Re: considering a new system and a sshd hybrid drive
On Monday 30 December 2019 11:38:27 Alexander V. Makartsev wrote:
> On 30.12.2019 20:18, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > On Monday 30 December 2019 05:16:51 Alexander V. Makartsev wrote:
> >> On 29.12.2019 16:56, Gene Heskett wrote:
> >>> On Sunday 29 December 2019 04:42:20 Alexander V. Makartsev wrote:
> >>>> On 29.12.2019 12:37, shirish शिरीष wrote:
> >>>>> Dear all,
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Last year I had read some articles when I was looking to build a
> >>>>> system there seemed to problems with hybrid drives. Does anybody
> >>>>> know how things stand/look today and if anybody had any good/bad
> >>>>> experience with them ? IIRC, the issues were more to do with
> >>>>> the firmware rather than the hardware, is it the same or have
> >>>>> things improved ? which package I should be looking at if I'm
> >>>>> looking for solutions ?
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I am ok with using either a stable or an alpha/debian-installer
> >>>>> snapshot if people have had good experience.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Just so people have an idea about what hybrid drives are all
> >>>>> about, here are couple of links
> >>>>>
> >>>>> https://www.seagate.com/in/en/do-more/how-to-choose-between-hdd-
> >>>>>st or age-for-your-laptop-master-dm/
> >>>>>
> >>>>> https://www.howtogeek.com/195262/hybrid-hard-drives-explained-wh
> >>>>>y- yo u-might-want-one-instead-of-an-ssd/
> >>>>
> >>>> I strongly suggest against hybrid drives. It's just added
> >>>> complexity and therefore more ways and parts to fail with time.
> >>>> If you considering to buy hybrid HDD, chances are high you simply
> >>>> want faster performance for your system. I don't see why to
> >>>> choose slightly better solution (hybrid) over fastest one (SSDs).
> >>>> For a system disk and\or laptop upgrade, I'd stick with plain
> >>>> MLC-based (2 bit) NAND 250GB+ SSD (or NVMe if your system allows
> >>>> it), because they have the best reliability+performance+price
> >>>> ratings. Try to avoid TLC-based SSDs because they have much lower
> >>>> reliability and performance in comparison to MLC-based SSDs, but
> >>>> also much cheaper. And completely avoid QLC-based SSDs, which are
> >>>> cheap, but slow and unreliable, similar to USB flash drives.
> >>>> Backup your data (obvious), monitor health of your SSDs using
> >>>> S.M.A.R.T. and you'll be just fine.
> >>>> Also, watch out for manufacturers who use dark marketing
> >>>> practices, offering MLC-based (3-bit) NAND in advertisement,
> >>>> which is non-sense, but in reality they should be called
> >>>> TLC-based (3-bit) NAND, and also avoid manufacturers who is
> >>>> hiding real TBW or DWPD ratings of their SSD products and offer
> >>>> only useless MTBF rating. By using TBW or DWPD ratings you can
> >>>> calculate how long SSD will last in your estimated work-load.
> >>>
> >>> So how does one tell what sort of a drive I've bought half a dozen
> >>> of for under a 50 dollar bill for a 240 gig with a sata interface
> >>> actually is? ADATA's on sale usually.
> >>>
> >>> I've so far used them for a couple years, either on a std sata
> >>> cable, as the only drive in a cnc machine or on a usb-3 to sata
> >>> adapter. I've had zero drive failures and one adapter cable
> >>> failure, with the 2 latest installed as swap and work drives for
> >>> compiling both kernels and makeing deb's of linuxcnc on an rpi4.
> >>> Cuts a kernel build time by several hours, but I have noted they
> >>> do get a lot slower if the file being copied is several gigabytes.
> >>> Giving an 2Gb rpi4 a 10 Gb swap to play in is plumb amazing. Using
> >>> 197 megs to build the rs-274 interpreter of linuxcnc there was no
> >>> slowdown while doing it.
> >>>
> >>> There may be better choices out there, and I'd like to be able to
> >>> tell the difference, but these so far have been more that good
> >>> enough for "the girls I go with".
> >>>
> >>> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> >>
> >> You have to read through specifications that are available on
> >> official web site of the manufacturer.
> >> In addition to what I described in my previous email for OP, ADATA
> >> is also takes an opportunity to trick their customers, for an
> >> example they sell "Ultimate SU650" model which, according to their
> >> web site filter [1] could be either TLC or MLC type, and you still
> >> can't tell exact NAND type by reading specifications table [2] or
> >> the sticker on the device itself.
> >> Obviously, there is no way to see if manufacturers are lying about
> >> their specifications before you actually buy the specific model of
> >> SSD. And after you bought it, you can check the internals of it
> >> with SSD-Z utility. [3]
> >> I don't know if similar utility exists for Linux, though.
> >>
> >> [1] https://www.adata.com/en/Solid-State-Drives/25/
> >> [2] https://www.adata.com/en/specification/503
> >> [3] http://aezay.dk/aezay/ssdz/
> >
> > Thank you Alexander, interesting links, particularly the last one.
> > I've not even tried to snoop thru these as so far they Just Work.
> >
> > Is smartctl growing any knowledge of these yet? I've not been aware
> > of any updates to it in a year or so.
>
> I don't think so. This information is quite the low-level stuff, far
> beyond simple S.M.A.R.T. manipulations, so I'd expect such
> functionality more from projects like "lshw", "hdparm" or similar.
>
> > What os does this SSDZ work on?
>
> It is relatively new at this moment and supports Windows only. I don't
> know if author has Linux support in mind for future releases.
Bummer since this has been a linux only house since 1998,
Thank you Alexander
Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
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- Louis D. Brandeis
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>
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