Re: obsolete wiki (no /etc/inittab)
On Saturday 19 August 2017 05:32:25 Jonathan de Boyne Pollard wrote:
> Felix Miata:
> > What's needed is incentive for code creators to simultaneously
> > document, with ample examples that man pages usually omit, even if
> > it's only in formal, non-wikified docs that wikis can point to.
That would be fine if the README had those links in it, but how to
enforce it?
>
> Gene Heskett:
> > It should be an iron-clad rule that a developer submitting his itch
> > scratcher code to a distribution must be subscribed to that
> > distributions user list BEFORE he can commit.
>
> That does not work and does not scale.
Scale? How many active developers would that involve? Surely the
mailing list machines capacity can't be a problem. I don't really care
if the developer never replies, but he should be at least reading it to
collect the users of his code flowers for a job well done and bricks
thrown when its a screwed up mess only he knows how to make work..
> What would work is what M.
> Miata said, which is to inculcate in software developers a culture of
> always providing doco with the software, and regarding the job as not
> complete unless there is doco.
I agree, but how to enforce it?
>
> That said, an obscure page (which people even in this thread were hard
> pressed to find) on someone else's wiki does not really count.
Nope. The link and paths to the doco must be complete enough a google
search can find it, in the top page of the search results.
> Furthermore: In this *particular* regard, the developer-provided doco
> actually *is* clear. The upstart manual page for inittab has been
> warning that the file is obsolete for over ten years, and that manual
> page is copied all over the WWW making it fairly easy to come across.
> (Examples: https://linux.die.net/man/5/inittab
> https://askubuntu.com/questions/34308/
> https://serverfault.com/questions/147430/
> http://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/precise/man5/inittab.5.html)
Its becoming obsolete is NOT mentioned in my wheezy approved and supplied
man page for it, I just read it this instant. So if you call it widely
publicized it fails that definition AFAIAC.
>
> The systemd people have not explicitly documented inittab, as the
> upstart people did, although they have explicitly documented run
> levels as "obsolete" in the systemd manual page for runlevel. This,
> too, has been copied around the WWW, albeit somewhat less. (Examples:
> https://manpages.debian.org/stretch/systemd-sysv/runlevel.8.en.html
> http://man7.org/linux/man-pages/man8/runlevel.8.html
> https://www.mankier.com/8/runlevel)
>
I have only one machine with a new enough install, jessie, to have a some
of systemd, so I am still learning. Fortunately when I screw up, it
tries to educate me, but the wet ram is A: north of 80 yo, and B: not
yet "in the habit" since the rest of my stuff is running wheezy.
> I for one have been attempting spreading the word about inittab, too.
>
> * http://jdebp.eu./FGA/inittab-is-history.html
>
> * http://jdebp.eu./Softwares/nosh/guide/introduction.html
>
> * https://unix.stackexchange.com/a/248313/5132
>
> * https://unix.stackexchange.com/a/196197/5132
>
> * https://askubuntu.com/a/834323/43344
>
> * http://jdebp.eu./Softwares/nosh/guide/runlevel.html
>
> In this particular case, one cannot really level the charge of
> developers not documenting this. It is amply documented, by
> developers of multiple projects, in their manual pages in their
> handbooks/guides and on their WWW sites, for over a decade. The
> deficiencies of Debian's own wiki cannot legitimately be laid at the
> feet of the developers of the various softwares.
>
> One such developer even tried to donate to you an update to the Debian
> Policy Manual that explained both /etc/inittab (in section 9.3.4) and
> the changes that arrived in 2014, to replace your woefully outdated
> one:
I'm assuming the "you" above is aimed at debian as I do not recall it
otherwise.
> * http://jdebp.eu./Proposals/DebianPolicy/
Which again, is a link I've just now become aware of. I am for it of
course but it has that unmistakable odor of the N.I.H. syndrome on the
part of Debian. Is the bug machine the proper place to open some windows
and let that odor dissipate?
Thanks Jonathan.
Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>
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