Sjoerd Hardeman wrote:
Dirk schreef:I think the point Nate is making is that you can just configure X as not to use HAL (see the link in one of the previous mails). If you also not want hal installed, just make a "nohal" dummy package with a "provides:hal" attribute set.You would have much more credibility in this thread if you provided solid technical reasons why HAL is bad rather than stomping your feet while saying "I don't like it!" Please provide a technical reason why HAL is unacceptable.HAL causes enough technical problems and negative side-effects. Just Google for that.But don't shift the focus away to "Is there a technical problem?" while the real problem is the /whole idea/ of HAL.Long time Linux users require choice, transparency, and CONTROL.HAL is the complete opposite and now it is needlessly enforced per dependency in Debian.One "Hardware Abstraction Layer" (the Linux Kernel) should be enough.People who want more than one can install Ubuntu which is a good distribution.
This is very convenient to say, right? Of course, one can make a dummy package and spend his time searching Google and this mailing list for hints to make X11 work again without HAL. But it turns out to be a moving target and a waste of time with every update of the distribution.
I've done so. More than once. And that is that.
Yet, the X.org dev's (not the debian devs) are moving to using hal for xorg (at least, that's my understanding). So that's why debian is too. Discussing there makes more sense.
I did. According to them DeviceKit is going to replace HAL. http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/DeviceKitWhy do they, /themself/, see a need to replace HAL? And will devicekit be more acceptable to people who care more than even I do?
Will it be a choice?
And, finally, you haven't answered the question on what's wrong with hal. I'm using it without problems, and even still feel in control when needed by altering the .fdi files in /usr/share/hal. So no, I don't see the problem, please explain.
Geeez... the problem is that it was promoted to a requirement for running a Debian Desktop while there was no need for it in the first place with alternatives like Ubuntu or Windows(!) at hand.
Another problem are the people who think they need to turn Linux into something like a Windows to appeal to people who don't even care/know enough about which OS they use. By this HAL is neglecting the best part of Linux for the sake of "Linux, ready for the desktop?" headlines on Slashdot.
Dirk