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Re: Multiple Hard Drives



On Tue, 16 Nov 2004 01:12:55 -0500
Shawn McCuan <mccuan@wave3.org> wrote:

normal output.. is this already formatted? If it is, do you want to keep
the information on it. If it's not formatted, the you will need to
format, using fdisk

Hit "m" to get to the menu, and select "p" to see how it currently is
partitioned.

My external USB hard drive looks like this;

Command (m for help): p

Disk /dev/sda: 4304 MB, 4304240640 bytes
255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 523 cylinders
Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes

   Device Boot      Start         End      Blocks   Id  System
/dev/sda1               1         523     4200966   83  Linux

I have used all of the hard drive for one partition.

look on the web (google) for the partition howto.

> When i type the command it gives me this:
> i didnt type anything at the command prompt.
> ------
> debian:/home/shawn# sudo fdisk /dev/hdb
> 
> The number of cylinders for this disk is set to 4866.
> There is nothing wrong with that, but this is larger than 1024,
> and could in certain setups cause problems with:
> 1) software that runs at boot time (e.g., old versions of LILO)
> 2) booting and partitioning software from other OSs
>    (e.g., DOS FDISK, OS/2 FDISK)
> 
> Command (m for help):
> ---
> 
> Rodney D. Myers wrote:
> 
> >On Tue, 16 Nov 2004 00:46:01 -0500
> >Shawn McCuan <mccuan@wave3.org> wrote:
> >
> >Debian does show your second hard drive, look for;
> >
> >  
> >
> >>hdb: MAXTOR 6L040J2, ATA DISK drive
> >>    
> >>
> >
> >below.
> >
> >in a shell type -> sudo fdisk /dev/hdb
> >and see what it states. Is this formatted for linux or windos?
> >
> >  
> >
> >>I typed in dmesg in Konsole and got the following...im not exactly
> >>sure what any of it means as i am fairly new to linux.
> >>
> >>
> >>debian:/home/shawn# dmesg
> >> device 00:11.1
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 11 with 00:0d.0
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 11 with 01:00.0
> >>Linux NET4.0 for Linux 2.4
> >>Based upon Swansea University Computer Society NET3.039
> >>Initializing RT netlink socket
> >>Starting kswapd
> >>VFS: Disk quotas vdquot_6.5.1
> >>devfs: v1.12c (20020818) Richard Gooch (rgooch@atnf.csiro.au)
> >>devfs: boot_options: 0x0
> >>pty: 256 Unix98 ptys configured
> >>Serial driver version 5.05c (2001-07-08) with HUB-6 MANY_PORTS
> >>MULTIPORT SHARE_IRQ SERIAL_PCI enabled
> >>ttyS00 at 0x03f8 (irq = 4) is a 16550A
> >>ttyS01 at 0x02f8 (irq = 3) is a 16550A
> >>PCI: Found IRQ 11 for device 00:0d.0
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 11 with 00:11.1
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 11 with 01:00.0
> >>Redundant entry in serial pci_table.  Please send the output of
> >>lspci -vv, this message (12b9,1008,12b9,00d3)
> >>and the manufacturer and name of serial board or modem board
> >>to serial-pci-info@lists.sourceforge.net.
> >>ttyS04 at port 0x9400 (irq = 11) is a 16550A
> >>COMX: driver version 0.85 (C) 1995-1999 ITConsult-Pro Co.
> >><info@itc.hu> RAMDISK driver initialized: 16 RAM disks of 8192K size
> >>1024 blocksize Initializing Cryptographic API
> >>NET4: Linux TCP/IP 1.0 for NET4.0
> >>IP: routing cache hash table of 4096 buckets, 32Kbytes
> >>TCP: Hash tables configured (established 32768 bind 65536)
> >>Linux IP multicast router 0.06 plus PIM-SM
> >>RAMDISK: cramfs filesystem found at block 0
> >>RAMDISK: Loading 3788 blocks [1 disk] into ram disk... done.
> >>Freeing initrd memory: 3788k freed
> >>VFS: Mounted root (cramfs filesystem).
> >>Freeing unused kernel memory: 96k freed
> >>NET4: Unix domain sockets 1.0/SMP for Linux NET4.0.
> >>Uniform Multi-Platform E-IDE driver Revision: 7.00beta4-2.4
> >>ide: Assuming 33MHz system bus speed for PIO modes; override with
> >>idebus=xx ide: late registration of driver.
> >>PDC20265: IDE controller at PCI slot 00:06.0
> >>PCI: Found IRQ 5 for device 00:06.0
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 5 with 00:0c.0
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 5 with 00:11.2
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 5 with 00:11.3
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 5 with 00:11.4
> >>PDC20265: chipset revision 2
> >>PDC20265: not 100% native mode: will probe irqs later
> >>PDC20265: (U)DMA Burst Bit DISABLED Primary PCI Mode Secondary PCI
> >>Mode. PDC20265: FORCING BURST BIT 0x00->0x01 ACTIVE
> >>    ide2: BM-DMA at 0xa000-0xa007, BIOS settings: hde:pio, hdf:pio
> >>    ide3: BM-DMA at 0xa008-0xa00f, BIOS settings: hdg:pio, hdh:pio
> >>VP_IDE: IDE controller at PCI slot 00:11.1
> >>PCI: Found IRQ 11 for device 00:11.1
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 11 with 00:0d.0
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 11 with 01:00.0
> >>VP_IDE: chipset revision 6
> >>VP_IDE: not 100% native mode: will probe irqs later
> >>ide: Assuming 33MHz system bus speed for PIO modes; override with
> >>idebus=xx VP_IDE: VIA vt8233 (rev 00) IDE UDMA100 controller on
> >>pci00:11.1
> >>    ide0: BM-DMA at 0x9000-0x9007, BIOS settings: hda:DMA, hdb:DMA
> >>    ide1: BM-DMA at 0x9008-0x900f, BIOS settings: hdc:DMA, hdd:DMA
> >>hda: MAXTOR 6L040J2, ATA DISK drive
> >>hdb: MAXTOR 6L040J2, ATA DISK drive
> >>blk: queue e0825b40, I/O limit 4095Mb (mask 0xffffffff)
> >>blk: queue e0825c7c, I/O limit 4095Mb (mask 0xffffffff)
> >>hdc: TDK CDRW401240B, ATAPI CD/DVD-ROM drive
> >>hdd: LITEON DVD-ROM LTD163, ATAPI CD/DVD-ROM drive
> >>hde: IOMEGA ZIP 100 ATAPI, ATAPI FLOPPY drive
> >>ide0 at 0x1f0-0x1f7,0x3f6 on irq 14
> >>ide1 at 0x170-0x177,0x376 on irq 15
> >>ide2 at 0xb400-0xb407,0xb002 on irq 5
> >>hda: attached ide-disk driver.
> >>hda: 78177792 sectors (40027 MB) w/1819KiB Cache, CHS=77557/16/63,
> >>UDMA(100) hdb: attached ide-disk driver.
> >>hdb: 78177792 sectors (40027 MB) w/1819KiB Cache, CHS=77557/16/63,
> >>UDMA(100) Partition check:
> >> /dev/ide/host0/bus0/target0/lun0: [PTBL] [4866/255/63] p1 p2 < p5 >
> >> /dev/ide/host0/bus0/target1/lun0: [PTBL] [4866/255/63] p1
> >>Journalled Block Device driver loaded
> >>kjournald starting.  Commit interval 5 seconds
> >>EXT3-fs: mounted filesystem with ordered data mode.
> >>kjournald starting.  Commit interval 5 seconds
> >>EXT3-fs: mounted filesystem with ordered data mode.
> >>Adding Swap: 1550232k swap-space (priority -1)
> >>EXT3 FS 2.4-0.9.19, 19 August 2002 on ide0(3,1), internal journal
> >>Real Time Clock Driver v1.10f
> >>hdc: attached ide-cdrom driver.
> >>hdc: ATAPI 48X CD-ROM CD-R/RW drive, 2048kB Cache, UDMA(33)
> >>Uniform CD-ROM driver Revision: 3.12
> >>hdd: attached ide-cdrom driver.
> >>hdd: ATAPI 48X DVD-ROM drive, 512kB Cache, UDMA(33)
> >>irda_init()
> >>Linux Tulip driver version 0.9.15-pre12 (Aug 9, 2002)
> >>PCI: Found IRQ 5 for device 00:0c.0
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 5 with 00:06.0
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 5 with 00:11.2
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 5 with 00:11.3
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 5 with 00:11.4
> >>tulip0:  MII transceiver #1 config 1000 status 786d advertising
> >05e1.>eth0: ADMtek Comet rev 17 at 0x9800, 00:04:5A:55:F8:A9, IRQ 5.
> >>SCSI subsystem driver Revision: 1.00
> >>hde: attached ide-scsi driver.
> >>scsi0 : SCSI host adapter emulation for IDE ATAPI devices
> >>  Vendor: IOMEGA    Model: ZIP 100           Rev: 23.D
> >>  Type:   Direct-Access                      ANSI SCSI revision: 00
> >>cmpci: version $Revision: 6.16 $ time 06:26:44 Sep  3 2004
> >>PCI: Found IRQ 10 for device 00:05.0
> >>cmpci: found CM8738 adapter at io 0xb800 irq 10
> >>cmpci: chip version = 055
> >>usb.c: registered new driver usbdevfs
> >>usb.c: registered new driver hub
> >>usb-uhci.c: $Revision: 1.275 $ time 06:26:46 Sep  3 2004
> >>usb-uhci.c: High bandwidth mode enabled
> >>PCI: Found IRQ 5 for device 00:11.2
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 5 with 00:06.0
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 5 with 00:0c.0
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 5 with 00:11.3
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 5 with 00:11.4
> >>usb-uhci.c: USB UHCI at I/O 0x8800, IRQ 5
> >>usb-uhci.c: Detected 2 ports
> >>usb.c: new USB bus registered, assigned bus number 1
> >>hub.c: USB hub found
> >>hub.c: 2 ports detected
> >>PCI: Found IRQ 5 for device 00:11.3
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 5 with 00:06.0
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 5 with 00:0c.0
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 5 with 00:11.2
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 5 with 00:11.4
> >>usb-uhci.c: USB UHCI at I/O 0x8400, IRQ 5
> >>usb-uhci.c: Detected 2 ports
> >>usb.c: new USB bus registered, assigned bus number 2
> >>hub.c: USB hub found
> >>hub.c: 2 ports detected
> >>PCI: Found IRQ 5 for device 00:11.4
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 5 with 00:06.0
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 5 with 00:0c.0
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 5 with 00:11.2
> >>PCI: Sharing IRQ 5 with 00:11.3
> >>usb-uhci.c: USB UHCI at I/O 0x8000, IRQ 5
> >>usb-uhci.c: Detected 2 ports
> >>usb.c: new USB bus registered, assigned bus number 3
> >>hub.c: USB hub found
> >>hub.c: 2 ports detected
> >>usb-uhci.c: v1.275:USB Universal Host Controller Interface driver
> >>irda_init()
> >>pci_hotplug: PCI Hot Plug PCI Core version: 0.5
> >>shpchp: acpi_shpchprm:get_device PCI ROOT HID fail=0x1001
> >>pci_hotplug: PCI Hot Plug PCI Core version: 0.5
> >>pciehp: acpi_pciehprm:get_device PCI ROOT HID fail=0x1001
> >>eth0: Setting full-duplex based on MII#1 link partner capability of
> >>41e1. spurious 8259A interrupt: IRQ7.
> >>cdrom: open failed.
> >>apm: BIOS version 1.2 Flags 0x03 (Driver version 1.16)
> >>[drm] Initialized radeon 1.7.0 20020828 on minor 0
> >>[drm:radeon_unlock] *ERROR* Process 16396 using kernel context 0
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 00 1a 8e 00 00 01 f8 00 00 "
> >>cdrom: open failed.
> >>hdd: command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete Error }
> >>hdd: command error: error=0x54
> >>end_request: I/O error, dev 16:40 (hdd), sector 64
> >>isofs_read_super: bread failed, dev=16:40, iso_blknum=16, block=32
> >>cdrom: open failed.
> >>hdd: command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete Error }
> >>hdd: command error: error=0x54
> >>end_request: I/O error, dev 16:40 (hdd), sector 64
> >>isofs_read_super: bread failed, dev=16:40, iso_blknum=16, block=32
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 00 1a 8e 00 00 01 f8 00 00 "
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 00 52 e7 00 00 01 f8 00 00 "
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 00 0f 19 00 00 08 f8 00 00 "
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 00 15 c8 00 00 08 f8 00 00 "
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 00 48 2b 00 00 08 f8 00 00 "
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 00 1a 8e 00 00 01 f8 00 00 "
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 00 52 e7 00 00 01 f8 00 00 "
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 00 92 89 00 00 01 f8 00 00 "
> >>hdd: irq timeout: status=0xd0 { Busy }
> >>hdd: irq timeout: error=0x00
> >>hdd: DMA disabled
> >>hdd: ATAPI reset complete
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 00 8d 2f 00 00 08 f8 00 00 "
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 00 8d 2f 00 00 08 f8 00 00 "
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 00 a7 a0 00 00 08 f8 00 00 "
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 00 1a 8e 00 00 01 f8 00 00 "
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 00 e7 39 00 00 08 f8 00 00 "
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 00 e7 39 00 00 08 f8 00 00 "
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 01 1f 9b 00 00 06 f8 00 00 "
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 01 1f 9b 00 00 06 f8 00 00 "
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 01 96 c6 00 00 02 f8 00 00 "
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 01 c0 c8 00 00 08 f8 00 00 "
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 01 c8 1b 00 00 08 f8 00 00 "
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 00 1a 8e 00 00 01 f8 00 00 "
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 01 dd 85 00 00 04 f8 00 00 "
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 02 1b a2 00 00 06 f8 00 00 "
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 00 1a 8e 00 00 01 f8 00 00 "
> >>hdd: packet command error: status=0x51 { DriveReady SeekComplete
> >Error>} hdd: packet command error: error=0x30
> >>ATAPI device hdd:
> >>  Error: Medium error -- (Sense key=0x03)
> >>  (reserved error code) -- (asc=0x02, ascq=0x00)
> >>  The failed "Read CD" packet command was:
> >>  "be 04 00 00 52 e7 00 00 01 f8 00 00 "
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>Rodney D. Myers wrote:
> >>
> >>    
> >>
> >>>On Tue, 16 Nov 2004 00:25:36 -0500
> >>>Shawn McCuan <mccuan@wave3.org> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> 
> >>>
> >>>      
> >>>
> >>>>Yet another question from me. I have two maxtor hardrives, but,
> >>>>        
> >>>>
> >>>debian>isnt even showing that I have a second hard drive. I want to
> >>>format>the second hardrive to EXT3 so its compatible with the OS,
> >>>but, if its>not showing up anywhere that I can see, what should I
> >do?>>      
> >>>
> >>>>Thanks;
> >>>>Shawn McCuan
> >>>>A linux newbie...
> >>>>   
> >>>>
> >>>>        
> >>>>
> >>>What does dmesg show?
> >>>
> >>> 
> >>>
> >>>      
> >>>
> >>    
> >>
> >
> >
> >  
> >
> 
> 


-- 
Rodney D. Myers <rdmyers@MtPalomar.net>	
Registered Linux User #96112
ICQ#:     AIM#:       YAHOO:
18002350  mailman452  mailman42_5

They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a 
little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.
        Ben Franklin - 1759

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