Re: [OT, FLAME] Linux Sucks
I think you've just made an unfounded logical leap. Why does _every_
distribution need a graphical installer to make linux on the desktop a
reality? Clearly the answer is, not every distro needs a graphical
installer. If a distribution wants to cater to server-type machines,
that's ok (it's great, really). If a distribution wants to cater to
elites, that's fine too. If a distribution wants to ensure that the
installer works when the console is a serial port, that's wonderful.
True. Perhaps it would have been better stated by saying that every distro
that wants to cater to Desktop users needs to implement a GUI installer (and
many other GUI tools).
Besides, linux on the desktop is a rather nebulous term. I know
several people who would love to roll out desktop boxes running linux
in their company; this would prevent joe clueless user from playing
solitaire, installing backgrounds and mouse cursors, etc. I suspect
you mean something very different, where linux becomes the Windows XP
killer. That may or may not happen. Personally, I think there are
two problems with the latter vision; the average (desktop) computer
user views the computer as an appliance, but the average computer is
too costly and not reliable enough to be an appliance. Secondly, as
long as software companies feel they can make money and "lock in
market share" by releases patent encumbered software (think
audio/video codecs) and as long as major players _use_ that software,
linux is fighting an uphill battle since linux represents the opposite
philosophy, that of openness.
I would love to see Linux become the Windows XP killer. When enough people
realize that openness (in standards, file formats, interfaces, and so on) is
the only way to ensure that everything can play nice together, things will
change. Unfortunately the public needs much education before this can
become a reality.
Additionally, I would love to see Debian be at the forefront of the push to
kill windoze. I like Debian and will continue to use it regardless. If I
can't figure something out, I don't mind hopping on my other machine (also a
Debian box) and hitting the search engines. But many people simply won't do
that. I'm not saying that Debian should be dumbed down any, but that they
should make tools available (without taking away the CLI, CURSES, or
whatever other tools the gurus love to use) that make it easier for the
average end user to use Debian.
I think that this is really important because IMHO Debian represents the
best of free software.
Devil's advocate: how do you knmow firestarter does what it says it is
doing if you don't understand iptables? Please don't take this as a
personal attack; I just feel if you don't understand the technology,
using said technology is fraught with peril. For a real world
example, think "routing protocols" and look hard at the internet.
There is breakage every day caused by ignorance.
I understand that you are not atacking me :-) But, I take it on faith that
if I can apt-get something from an official Debian mirror (especially on the
stable tree) that it will work as advertised.
Your argument could just as easily be applied to a commercial windoze
product like Zone Alarm. In the case of Zone Alarm, though, I can't
download and look at the source even if I wanted to. At least with
firestarter I can, or at least do 'iptables -nvL' 8-)
Ok, linux needs to be marketed to the average user. Why does that
equate to "debian must satisfy the needs of all users" ? Note: I'm
not saying debian shouldn't be easier to install, I just want you to
think about why things that are good for "linux" may not necessarily
be good for debian[1].
Finally, let me quote Doug Gwyn:
GUIs normally make it simple to accomplish simple actions and
impossible to accomplish complex actions.
Ah, the random sig generator comes through again :-)
[1] You realise debian is about more than just linux, right?
Again, Debian doesn't have to satisfy the needs of all users. But if it
were marketed more to the average user it would be a very good thing for the
reasons I stated above.
-Roberto Sanchez
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