Re: I can't beleive this
On Mon, Mar 15, 1999 at 08:05:01AM +0800, ivan wrote:
> Having overcome the partitioning issues, the installation is still a pain.
> My experience with Linux is limited to Debian having started with the
> frozen Bo. Since then I have had to reinstall at least 20+ times because I
> simply didn't understand the options that were being given to me during the
> install and thus configured the system wrongly.
You don't need to reinstall to reconfigure parts of your system or single
packages. I can hardly understand what options would require a reinstall if
given the wrong answer (beside partitioning, I think).
> Again I would like to suggest that the install could be made much easier
> with a couple of (not necessarily simple) changes. For instance, providing
> a kernal with SB16/AWE32/AWE64 support already present and working.
The kernel can't guess or detect the interrupts and ioports. AWE cards also
require often pnp set up. You are asking for too much. However, ALSA will
have better sound support and auto detection. The OSS Lite sound driver is
really crap.
> Same
> also with PPP which most people want - if they didn't have modems they
> wouldn't be on the net and so, probably, wouldn't have discovered Linux
> anyway.
Did you try pppconfig? It is started automatically in recent boot disks
(since hamm, I think).
> During the install itself there are too many packages being put on the
> system IMHO. Why not install just ae (or joe or ee or ...) instead of all
> of these "easy to use editors" plus emacs plus vi plus xemacs ?
Are emacs and xemacs both with standard priority?
I am not sure if you complain about too many packages being "standard", or
about too much choice. There will be a good approach for the second problem
in apt gui (supersets or alike). The first needs explanation. VI should be
on any Unix-like system. Emacs _is_ standard. I agree that not both emacs
and xemacs should beinstalled automatically.
> Why not,
> if a X type setup has been chosen just install Netscape (plus maybe Lynx)
> instead of NS, Lynx, Mozilla, W3 etc ... These sorts of examples just go
> on and on.
Netscape is not part of Debian, sorry. I would find it VERY annoying if
selecting X would select a web browser, too. Again, I don't know what you
exactly are complaining about (see above).
> I don't know about anybody else but I keep asking myself why, if the
> installation is as easy as the propaganda suggests, so many newbies keep
> asking the same questions ?
We can't do it right for everyone. If a certain problem is really obvious,
sometimes someone volunteers to implement a clean solutiopn. I remember the
time when PPP configuration questions were popping up every two days or so
on debian-user, adn then some nice guy wrote pppconfig. I hardly see a PPP
related question on debian-user anymore.
> PS. I am aware that installing an OS is not a little thing but that comment
> sums up how I felt. BTW, the reason I perservere now with Linux is that I
> can see the potential and still refuse to be beaten. I figure if even one
> other person can make the whole thing work then so can I. I will not stop
> until I win.
That's the right attitude! Seriously: There is room for improvement, but
some things that look like small steps are really big steps. They will be
made, but we'll need some time.
I think people are expecting too much from Linux. Okay, we have hundreds and
thousands of developers, but everyone doing it voluntarily and in spare time
(well, some are paid, but they are the exceptions).
Then, Linux is only 5 or 6 years old (the kernel). There is older software,
too (GNU), but nevertheless, it a is surprisingly short time. Compare this
with MS Windows, who didn't manage to get a stable operating system at all
after years of $$$ development.
And then, when MS releases BS, people live with it. In Linux, everyone wants
the most perfect solution right now. That's okay, it is motivating, but only
if it is mentioned in an ebcouraging way.
Thanks,
Marcus
--
`Rhubarb is no Egyptian god.' Debian http://www.debian.org finger brinkmd@
Marcus Brinkmann GNU http://www.gnu.org master.debian.org
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