Re: packaging DiscoDOS - a cli tool for vinyl DJs
This is very frustrating to read.
On Sat, May 16, 2020 at 6:04 AM Thomas Goirand <zigo@debian.org> wrote:
>
> On 5/16/20 3:36 AM, Paul Wise wrote:
> > Would it be fair to say that your main objection is that Ubuntu has
> > much higher popularity than Debian
>
> This is what I regret, indeed. It's been like that for many years, and
> the trend isn't reversing. We should ask ourselves why. From my point of
> view, I see it as a problem of marketing more than OS content or
> technical excellence.
No, I think they do things better. Their installer is much better, and it's
a *lot* easier to switch. They had signed UEFI images before us,
and they enable things like firmware for wifi cards. This allows
Ubuntu to be easier for non-technical users to install computers
without understanding main vs contrib vs nonfree, how to disable
SecureBoot or what a firmware package is. We have lessons
to learn about usability and we've not learned them, and remained
stubborn about it.
They're able to do a lot of this by focusing on just a few arches, and
not every arch under the sun.
To some degree, we (as Debian) are designed to enable projects
like Ubuntu more than ever become Ubuntu.
> > and so the Ubuntu policy to work
> > upstream where possible leads people to come to Debian without
> > necessarily caring about the Debian community or users but more about
> > Ubuntu users?
>
> We are lucky this happens.
No, it's explicit messaging by Ubuntu.
I was an Ubuntu member before I was a Debian Developer.
I'd like to think I've been a stable and long-time member of the community.
I am only here because of Ubuntu. If someone tries to upload a
NEW package, they're always told to go to Debian.
>
> > Personally, I think over the years Ubuntu's Debian involvement has
> > been a net positive for Debian
>
> Indeed.
>
> > both in terms of packaging and other
> > technical changes and in terms of attracting new contributors, often
> > Ubuntu migrants end up contributing to Debian more than Ubuntu. I
> > think the same goes for derivatives in general.
>
> That's truth. I am very thankful for Canonical to contribute things like
> Grub, Python, MySQL and many other things directly in Debian. It's very
> nice that some full time employees can take care of stuff like that.
> It's also nice that some components are explicitly worked on to be the
> same in both distros. I also like the fact that they push contributors
> to work on upstream Debian.
>
> Never the less, I've seen multiple occurrences where some people vaguely
> knew what Ubuntu was, but never heard of Debian. Saw others saying wrong
> things, like Ubuntu was updating faster (which is wrong, as packages are
> updated in Sid first). And many other things of that type. Isn't it
> legitimate that I'm asking myself why? Shouldn't the Debian project try
> to question its image?
Let's fix our usability issues and maybe more "power users" will install
Debian.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Thomas Goirand (zigo)
>
--
All programmers are playwrights, and all computers are lousy actors.
#define sizeof(x) rand()
:wq
--
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