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Re: Can't send mail with Gnus! :(

On Thu, 11 Dec 2003 20:39:25 -0500, Peter S Galbraith
<p.galbraith@globetrotter.net> posted to gmane.linux.debian.devel.emacsen:
 >> - Multiple mailboxes
 > MH-E simply lies on top on an MH implementation.  While there is POP
 > support in nmh (and IMAP in mu-mh), I simply use fetchmail to get my
 > mail, which gives it to postfix which gives it to procmail.  Therefore
 > having multiple mailboxes is not a problem.

Not handling IMAP properly is a major deficiency IMHO. Anything which
treats IMAP as if it were POP is flawed. I need IMAP to work like
${beer} intended, i.e. messages are stored on the server along with
any state information that I or my MUA needs in order to handle them

I switched from (RMAIL to VM to) Wanderlust to Gnus and while I can
hardly comment on the current state of RMAIL (last version I used was
with Emacs 19.something), I can offer the following subjective

  * VM has some "attitude problems" which I kept running into again
    and again. There are hooks for many things but the code I have
    looked at (admittedly mostly VM 6.xx) was a textbook example of
    how not to write maintainable, extensible code. I was able to grok
    enough of it to code advice around many of the features I wanted
    to customize, but on the whole, it didn't feel a whole lot
    different from the frustration I normally associate with
    closed-source software. Documentation was impressive on the face
    of it, but it covered some stone-age version and was sometimes
    even not accurate for how VM 4.x actually worked. Also, last time
    I looked, IMAP was not handled properly (i.e. "POP-over-IMAP")

  * I only briefly tried Wanderlust. I liked some things but the
    Debian packaging mess at the time (wanderlust vs wl versus wl-beta
    vs wl2 and between them various outdated and/or bleeding-edge
    and/or broken versions all over stable, unstable, and testing)
    made me steer clear of it. I'm running on stable and at the time I
    wasn't qualified to maintain my own backport. Maybe now I would
    try harder. Also at least at the time, the documentation sucked
    unless you were fluent in Japanese. (English was but comprehend
    not and of date it out there.)

  * I avoided Gnus for a long time for mail, because I tried it once
    and wasn't able to cope. No doubt at the time (when I had only
    just barely switched from GNUS 4.x to Gnus 5.x) the documentation
    was part of the problem. I find that now, more often than not, the
    only problem with the documentation is that there's more of it
    than I can conveniently keep tabs on. The same problem with
    features. Most of them make a lot of sense, and if you can
    tolerate the feeping creaturism of Emacs, I guess you should be
    able to cope with Gnus, too :-)

I like many of the ideas of MH and if I didn't want to be able to
access my email over orthodox IMAP, I would still be considering it
very seriously.

/* era */

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