Re: Debian systemd survey
On 05/24/2013 01:15 AM, brian m. carlson wrote:
I can use only parts of coreutils if I desire.
The same is true for systemd. Ubuntu is using parts of systemd
without actually using the daemon itself.
Also, coreutils does not
start services on startup that I do not need.
Aeh, what the heck are you comparing here? My cat also doesn't
fly and my hamster doesn't play the guitar. coreutils doesn't
start services because it isn't an init daemon.
However, what systemd actually does as compared to all other
init systems, it only starts the services you actually need.
It won't start ssh, for example, unless someone needs it. upstart,
on the other hand, starts ssh once the other services it depends
on are present (unless they changed that design aspect in more
recent versions of upstart), even though you actually don't
need ssh right now. It just starts it because its dependencies
are fulfilled, while systemd actually starts ssh once a process
or a target explicitly requires it.
Thus, upstart actually turns the dependency chain upside down
which is actually one of the main reason the systemd developers
started from scratch instead of jumping the upstart band wagon.
It's an inherent design issue in upstart.
systemd, on the other
hand, has spawned systemd-journald, which I do not want or need, which
is autorestarted, and which cannot be stopped with service. Since I am
not using its functionality, there is no point in having the service
running. rsyslog is very capable.
You can use systemd without the journal, it's optional. And, btw, it's
not rsyslog which is broken but the fact that logging the way syslog
does is quite a mess. There is no syntax convention for any logging
whatsoever so you will have to come up with scripts to parse syslog
for every single daemon that you want to watch.
The systemd journal, OTOH, uses a defined format for the logging
entries which means you can easily search your logs for any
events matching a certain daemon and severity type of event
and so on. It's much more powerful.
Also, traditionally init has been limited to starting and stopping
groups of services. It has not been involved in logging, session
management, seat management, hotkey handling, or suspend and resume,
except perhaps to start and stop the services which perform those
functions. However well-intentioned, systemd does a lot more than init
traditionally has, and definitely encroaches into areas that were not
traditionally init-related. The Unix Way is to use separate processes
for separate tasks.
"Traditionally, TVs and monitors used CRTs and discrete parts as
components. We are therefore not allowed to improve the design
and use LC displays and integrated circuits."
Please stop treating the "The Unix Way" as the ultimate design
concept which already has reached perfection and must not get
unchanged for eternity.
Did you, in fact know, that even the creators of the original
Unix concept weren't quite happy with the design and actually
replaced Unix with something called Plan 9?
Cheers,
Adrian
--
.''`. John Paul Adrian Glaubitz
: :' : Debian Developer - glaubitz@debian.org
`. `' Freie Universitaet Berlin - glaubitz@physik.fu-berlin.de
`- GPG: 62FF 8A75 84E0 2956 9546 0006 7426 3B37 F5B5 F913
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