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Re: Debug output etc, cluttering the terminal

Christoph Egger <christoph@debian.org> writes:

> Neil Williams <codehelp@debian.org> writes:
>> On Sun, 15 Aug 2010 02:23:32 +0000
>> "brian m. carlson" <sandals@crustytoothpaste.net> wrote:
>>> On Sun, Aug 15, 2010 at 12:09:42AM +0100, Neil Williams wrote:
>> Redirect stderr when opening the file or work out why okular was
>> selected in the first place. Moaning in the general direction of all
>> developers everywhere isn't helpful. Do something to identify the
>> problem, not the symptom. BTW evince produces debug messages when
>> loading some PDF files too, so this isn't just an okular thing.
>     Yeah but I've never seen scramblings on my terminals long after
> evince has quit as these kde stuff does with some backgrounded helpers
> still running (and not ever terminating) and continuously writing to
> some terminal that happens to have started the first KDE app or so.

Full ACK.

Those are DEBUG messages. They are not relevant or usefull for 99.9% of
all users and the only thing they do is annoy. Some of them have been
around for years so clearly they are not something anyone is working on.
And no, I'm not talking about the specific messages posted before. This
is a general problem of KDE and somewhat less gtk apps.

Neil: I'm sorry but your proposed solution is also stupid. If the user
redirects 2>/dev/null then actual errors will also not be shown and then
users will come complaining why something doesn't work while the error
message would have told them.

There is a reason behind the unix philosophy for programs to shut up
when there is no error. The reason is so that when there is an error it
shows and will be read. Spewing tons of debug messages per default just
makes people not read the output and hides any real errors.


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