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Re: Release update



Hi,

why two packages? A little bit of magic should do it: Service gets
installed turned off, and whatever the administrator sets is respected -
on upgrade, on logrotate, on boot.
This would require some clarifications (is update-rc.d now for
administrators or for package maintainers) and some common guidelines
(some packages currently use /etc/defaults/something, some use the
symlinks in /etc/rc?.d directly, others have something set in
/etc/init.d/something or use some magic, like checking for a line in
/etc/inetd.conf).

Ideally, all network daemons, from the administrator POV:
 * are installed disabled
 * may be started temporarily (/etc/init.d/package start)
   - then being logrotated, restarted on upgrade, but no start on boot
 * may be started permanently (perhaps symlinking in /etc/rc?.d)
   - logrotated, restarted on upgrade, restarted on boot
 * may then be temporarily disabled (/etc/init.d/package stop)
   - no logrotate restart, no start on upgrade, but start on boot.

That is, for each service we have two states ( (not)running generally
and (not)running right now) which should both be off on installation and
never be changed by upgrades or cronjobs.

[For correctness sake: since on boot the "right now" state is undefined,
starting the service according to the "generally" state is compliant
with these rules].

Questions to be solved: how to implement, what interface for package
maintainers, what interface for administrators

nomeata


Am Di, den 30.03.2004 schrieb Zefram um 16:08:
> Patrice Fortier wrote:
> >I had updates for ssh, portmap and nfs-common last week, and
> >each update restarted its service even if I had disabled them
> >(update-rc.d -f xxx remove).
> ...
> 
> All of this rather resembles Bug#176009 (cron script starts a stopped lpd)
> which I submitted over a year ago (just adding to the list of gripes in
> this thread).  We clearly have a general problem with network daemons,
> not just a problem with a few specific ones.
> 
> Therefore, I suggest that we separate each of these daemon packages into
> two, one that provides the daemon software and a separate one to run it.
> That way those of us who want to install a daemon and use it in our own
> way would not be hampered by someone's idea of how the daemon should
> normally be run.  And where the daemon is packaged with a client,
> installing the client wouldn't cause an unwanted daemon to run.
> 
> Example: the "ssh" package would, as now, provide both the ssh client
> and ssh server, but wouldn't contain an init script.  There would be a
> separate "ssh-daemon" package, with a dependency on the "ssh" package,
> and containing an init script.
> 
> Debian should ship with *no* network daemons listening by default.
> I'm rather surprised that it hasn't adopted this policy already.
-- 
Joachim "nomeata" Breitner
  nomeata@debian.org | ICQ# 74513189 | GPG-Keyid: 4743206C
  JID: joachimbreitner@amessage.de | http://people.debian.org/~nomeata

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