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Re: Are we losing users to Gentoo?

>>"Matt" == Matt Zimmerman <mdz@debian.org> writes:

 Matt> On Thu, Nov 21, 2002 at 09:43:03PM -0600, Manoj Srivastava wrote:
 >> You should really learn how to read. Having a goal does not
 >> imply one depends on succeeding. The journey is often worth it even
 >> if you do not depend on having attaining the goal.

 Matt> I read quite well, thank you.  Such personal attacks would not seem to fit
 Matt> with your lofty philosophy of elevating social norms.

	Then the only explanation is that you do not ken the
 distinction between goals and dependencies. Is that not worse? 

 Matt> To respond in kind, you should really learn how to construct sentences.

	Umm. elucidate.

 Matt> If you did not ever expect to reap any benefit from your
 Matt> "journey", then I suppose it would be a truly altruistic act,
 Matt> and you a being of rare character.  But if I may quote you
 Matt> again:

	Read what I said what the Geeta said. And how you deduce it is
 altruistic is beyond me, and, beyond logic. Letting the thought of
 the reaping benefits distract you from following your credo does not
 imply selfishness. It implies potential ineptitude.

 >>> On Thu, Nov 21, 2002 at 12:48:51AM -0600, Manoj Srivastava wrote:
 >>> >> and if I can change social norms of conduct so that I would nto be
 >>> >> hurt in the future?

 Matt> ...it certainly sounds as if you expect personal benefit.

	Of course the desired goal is personal
 benefit. Jesus. Depending on it is never implied.  If you still do
 not see how they are separate, well, I think we are done. My
 commiserations also go with you.

 Matt> That may be, but I don't see what that has to do with the sentiment that you
 Matt> have expressed.   _You_ said "Perhaps[...]if I can change social norms of
 Matt> conduct so that I would nto[sic] be hurt in the future?" as justification
 Matt> for your earlier statements.
 >> Yes, it would be nice if we learned to not ridicule people on
 >> this mailing list. Am I dependent on functioning, waiting with bated
 >> breath for it to happen? hell no.

 Matt> It would be nice if you did not needlessly provoke me, as part
 Matt> of your apparent personal conflict with Branden Robinson,
 Matt> simply because I sent a followup to one of his messages.
 Matt> However, I will survive it, and I do not expect this to change.

	I did not provike you,except to correct a basic error in logic
 about a posting of mine. Goal != dependency, if I may reiterate.

 Matt> In judgement of those who engage in ridicule on this mailing
 Matt> list, I do not believe that you have ground to stand on.

	Heck, I adapt to the tactics people use. (Except I continue to
 believe in logic)

 >> Eradicating poverty and world peace are worthy goals too. Are
 >> we all dependent on that, and shall wither away if that does not
 >> happen? 

 Matt> Appeal to popularity, overgeneralization, and hyperbole all in
 Matt> one sentence, as well as misstating my position.  This is a
 Matt> notable feat of non-argument.

	You can't seem to distinguish between a goal and a dependency,
 and yes, I did resort to extreme example in an attempt to deomstrate
 the distinction. Since it has been lost on you, I admit to the
 inefficacy of my message.

 Matt> This certainly sounds to me like your goal was to change others' conduct so
 Matt> that you would not be hurt in the future.
 >> Goal. Goal. Use a dictionary. Having a goal does not imply a
 >> dependence. 

 Matt> If your interest is in goals that you will never achieve, then

	Not never achive. May never achieve. There is a distinction,
 though it may be too fine for you to follow, given this thread.

 Matt> you are directly on track.  You are a stunning example of all
 Matt> of the behaviours that you would sorta kinda like to see
 Matt> change, but wouldn't mind if they never did, and you will never
 Matt> gain any ground by emulating the object of your criticism.

	Ah well. C'est la vie.

 not into cheek turning
 The bank called to tell me that I'm overdrawn, Some freaks are
 burning crosses out on my front lawn, And I *can't*believe* it, all
 the Cheetos are gone, It's just ONE OF THOSE DAYS! Weird Al Yankovic,
 "One of Those Days"
Manoj Srivastava   <srivasta@debian.org>  <http://www.debian.org/%7Esrivasta/>
1024R/C7261095 print CB D9 F4 12 68 07 E4 05  CC 2D 27 12 1D F5 E8 6E
1024D/BF24424C print 4966 F272 D093 B493 410B  924B 21BA DABB BF24 424C

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