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Re: ITP: squeak-vm, squeak-image, squeak-sources -- A highly portable Smaltalk system



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On Saturday 02 June 2001  7:37 pm, John Hasler wrote:
> Wolfgang writes:
> > That "weirdness" is a right.
>
> If you think about it carefully you will see that it is exactly the
> opposite.
>
> > So if Apple asks to give up that right to be able to use that
> > program, then it is a restriction.
>
> Apple is asking no one to give up anything.  They are merely
> attempting to comply with the law.
>
> > And as such this license is not free.
>
> Then neither is the GPL.

I am almost sorry I started this thread now.

Nobody ever claimed that the license was free in the DFSG sense (it is 
most assuredly non-free because of the restrictions on distribution of 
fonts).  I am more interested in whether it can be packaged for the 
archive even as non-free (in fact non-us/non-free).  Following some 
discussion on OPN earlier I am not so sure that it can.

as a reminder, the license is available at:
	http://people.debian.org/~bagpuss/copyright
for anyone who wishes to look at it.


5. Indemnification. You agree to indemnify and hold Apple harmless
   from any and all damages, liabilities, costs and expenses (including
   but not limited to attorneys' fees and costs of suit) incurred by
   Apple as a result of any claim, proceeding, and/or judgment to the
   extent it arises out of or is connected in any manner with the
   operation, use, distribution or modification of Modified Software, or
   the combination of Apple Software or Modified Software with other
   programs; provided that Apple notifies Licensee of any such claim or
   proceeding in writing, tenders to Licensee the opportunity to defend
   or settle such claim or proceeding at Licensee's expense, and
   cooperates with Licensee in defending or settling such claim or
   proceeding.

aj and others seemed to be pretty worried about clause 5 of the 
license. What *I* think it means is 'if you want to sue us then you 
have to pay our lawyers fees in order to do so'.  However I could see 
the point that some people made who thought that this clause may entail 
Debian being held accountable and responsible for any legal costs 
incurred by Apple in any action pertaining to the software.
If this *is* the case and Debian could be seen to be responsible and 
have to pay up under this clause even if Debian were not the plaintif 
in the particular case then I agree with the feeling I got from people 
on OPN tonight in that it probably should not be packaged and 
distributed by us. (which is a damn shame as the packaging is all 
finished and ready to go now, and I seriously do feel that it would be 
a useful and valuable addition to the archive).
I am attempting to find a contact email address for someone at Apple 
who might be able to clarify the point, however I am not holding out 
much hope of finding one before Monday (a search through the Apple 
website failed to find any likely looking address.  I do have a phone 
number for Apple UK customer relations, so I am hoping that they might 
be able to furnish me with some contact information.  I will have to 
wait for office hours to contact them though).  If anyone happens to 
already have contact information of this nature then I would be glad to 
hear from them.
In the meantime any thoughts anyone has on the matter are welcome (if 
flames then please direct them to my personal mailbox and not to the 
list.  I am thick skinned but some people just get bored and annoyed at 
all the flamey noise)
   [*thinking of asking for a debian-flames list*]

Thanks, and apologies for the flames some have seen fit to fan from 
what was supposed to be a fairly simple ITP and request for advice 
concerning the license.

- -- 
Stephen Stafford
GPG public key on request
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