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Re: calling Philip Hands <phil@hands.com> [OFF TOPIC]

Dale Scheetz <dwarf@polaris.net> writes:
> On 3 Jun 1999, Philip Hands wrote:
> > I tried relaying through it earlier today, and it seems not to be
> > relaying for me, so assuming it's been fixed, someone from polaris.net
> > simply needs to go to:
> > 
> >   http://www.orbs.org/closed1.cgi?address=
> > 
> > they'll be taken off the list.
> Can I do this, or does it have to be someone who "speaks" for polaris.net?

Well, I expect you can, but since ORBS will have mailed
postmaster@polaris.net telling them about the problem, when they were
added, you'd think that they'd have done this for themselves.

Perhaps you should ask polaris.net what they playing at.

> I _do_ have to say that the others in this thread who have suggested that
> it is my fault for where I live, or who I choose as my service provider is
> equivalent to racial bigotry and I am offended that any of my friends on
> this list would suggest such an obsurdity.

I think this is largely a confusion arising from the misapprehension
that you got bitten by my use of DUL, whereas it was actually ORBS.
Given that you are using your ISPs relay, you're doing everything you
can to comply with current spam avoidance best practice, so it's now your
ISPs job to get themselves of ORBS.

I've only recently started using ORBS, so if it turns out that they
have a tendency to list machines that don't actually have open relays,
I'll drop it, so please ask polaris.net what they're doing about it,
and if they say the ORBS folks are being unreasonable (with
justifications), I'll either drop ORBS entirely, or just list
mail.polaris.net as an exception.

> I will also say: "If you have a problem with someone elses server, (like
> it is an "open" relay) then the correct way to resolve such a problem is
> to contact the manager of the domain, not abuse all of the individuals
> using that domain as their home!"

Well, since ORBS will have done this when they first detected the open
relay, and since they apparently have a policy of delaying the
addition of smarthosts, so ISPs get a chance to get their act
together, I was working on the assumption that they'd done that phase
of the communication for me.

> Regecting the complete population of a domain, because one address spammed
> you is simply poor logic, and the definition of prejudiced (bigoted)
> behavior.

That's not what ORBS is about.  What it is about is listing sites that
have been used as spam relays, which are accessible from ORBS's site as
a relay (implying its generally open), and which hasn't been fixed,
despite a warning to the admin.  It is then up to people like myself,
who are able to configure their own MX server, to decide if I want to
take advantage of this data, to stop spam.

The side effect is that if an ISPs server is running as an open relay,
and they don't act to stop that, their customers will find that their
mail may start to bounce.  That's really the ISPs responsibility IMO.

The DUL (which has been discussed ad infinitum here) operates on
different assumptions, and has nothing to do with the polaris.net mail
bouncing problem.

Cheers, Phil.

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