Re: Yet another Linux distribution! :-)
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I find this interesting....
(I notice someone else mentioned something too...I guess say it and others
with similar ideas come out of the woodwork)
I thought of basing a Distribution on Debian but...
a VERY TINY dist...
in fact the way I am thinkin gof...it wouldn't matter
what it was base don...
the basic idea I had was a Dist that you put ina CD and a floppy
(standard install)...go through a few easy configs...
boom..instant X Terminal (litterally functionally an X Terminal...
would run completely off another system...the only local tools
would be used for upgrading to the newest version of the
X Server itself)
I was thinking Debian would make a good base for such a thing...
I dunno who would find it usefull but...
I know at school (WPI) they had rooms full of X Terminals and they
were very usefull...
and with this setup you could have another CHEAP PC running another
Log-in-able X interface
I think it woul dbe cool...but I don't see myself even starting on it for
another year (I don't know enough right now to do it...
and in 1 month I see some stuff happenin gin my personal life
which shoul dslow things down for a while)
- -Steve
On Fri, 1 May 1998, Jim Pick wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>
> I read with interest Bruce's post that he wants to work on another
> Linux distribution. :-)
>
> As long as we are talking "pie in the sky" stuff, I thought I'd let
> loose with the news that I am also developing an alternative Linux
> distribution. I've sort of hinted about it on several of my webpages
> anyways. I've had this idea for two years (at least), but it's just
> lately that I have actually started to work on it.
>
> Here are my plans:
>
> - mid/late-1999 for first release (codename: Skaha) - I'm not rushing
> things. :-)
>
> - it will be a strict subset of Debian (and will include support for
> upgrading to full Debian distribution via apt) - basically, Debian
> is the "upstream" distribution, and this would be a "downstream
> distribution"
>
> - dpkg based
>
> - probably using apt (perhaps with an additional front-end)
>
> - targetted towards desktop use only, no server apps, just a few games
>
> - minimal size - optimized for installation via 28.8k modem via FTP,
> which will be the primary distribution mechanism (not CD).
>
> - slickest, easiest install in the business
>
> - self-hosting (it has everything needed to compile itself)
>
> - 100% open source / DFSG compliant (no non-free or contrib packages)
>
> - minimal set of install options:
>
> 1) console only (with base application set)
>
> 2) X11 user (primarily Gnome/Gtk based, I hope)
>
> Includes base application set, with:
>
> one window manager, one editor, one file manager,
> one email/news program, several web browsers (with one
> front end), one documentation system, several scripting
> languages
>
> The following application sets can be chosen (preliminary):
>
> 2a) graphics - Gimp, 3D apps
> 2b) publishing - TeX, SGML, etc.
> 2c) small business - GnuCash, Inventory, Taxes
> 2d) CAD/Robotics/Control Systems
>
> 3) Developer - all tools and libraries required to make distribution
> self hosting.
>
> - sysadmin (and users) can use apt to install additional packages from
> Debian distribution.
>
> - initial distribution will be i386 GNU/Linux, localized for Canada
> and the USA. Beyond that, I may attempt a Cygnus GNU/Win32 hosted
> distribution, and maybe ever a GNU Hurd based one.
>
> - very strong technical direction. As little duplication as possible in
> terms of applications and libraries. Everything will be document-centric,
> and tutorial driven. There will be a single document model.
>
>
> It will be another Linux distribution - but it will also be a strict
> subset of stuff inside Debian. It will be promoted as such.
>
> It will not have an "open" development model as Debian has. Actually,
> initially, it will only have one developer (me). If my consulting
> business improves, I might consider paying people to help me out with
> it. I don't want any volunteers however, as that would lessen my
> control (anybody volunteering for Debian will be helping me out
> anyways).
>
> Most of the work I do will be "open" though, because it will appear in
> Debian first.
>
> The best way to think of this project of mine is basically as "Debian
> + editorial control". Or you might think of it as a "Jim's hobby
> project" -- a customized "hot rod" GNU/Linux.
>
> If it turns out well, I'll consider marketing it commercially (it
> should be marketable). I will offer a consulting service that
> consists of customizing the distribution for clients with
> "stylesheets" and "themes". I imagine that many local ISPs might want
> to offer their own customized version of Linux to their local small
> business clients and home users.
>
> As it will be "Open Source", other more-commercial distributions such
> as Red Hat, Caldera and SuSe can steal stuff with no complaints from
> me.
>
> The driving motivation for doing this isn't commercial though - it's
> basically a "soapbox" for me to express what I think should be in an
> OS, and what shouldn't. My point of view is that most of the code
> that a user really needs has been written already - most of the work
> needed to build a really nice OS doesn't consist of writing more code
> (too many free software projects are going down this road). Mostly,
> it's just a packaging/integration and documentation job to make the
> current codebase more digestable. Debian already does a lot of this,
> but this will be focused in a way Debian can't be.
>
> I plan to develop some documentation and live tutorial technology
> which will go far beyond what any free software app currently has.
> The whole system will be keyed off of the documentation - rather than
> leaving it as an afterthought. Much of the work I'm going to put into
> preparing documents and metadata for LinuxHQ and dwww will also go
> into this new system.
>
> The release schedule will vary dramatically from Debian's. There will
> be stable and development branches. There will be a new stable
> release approximately every two months (built from packages from the
> Debian unstable distribution, but tested). Security bugs will be
> immediately put into the stable release.
>
> Because there will only be a small set of packages to test, and a
> small closely-knit release team, rapid stable releases can be done.
>
> For the most part, the development branch will just be a strict subset
> of the Debian unstable distribution. Basically, it will be the same
> packages. Due to the differing release schedule, there will probably
> need to be quite a few non-maintainer fixes - but these will all be
> pushed upstream to Debian. Any packages tha I develop specifically
> for this distribution, I will also upload to Debian.
>
> There will be a separate bug system, but most bugs will be fed
> "upstream" to the Debian bug system (with patches if they are easy
> fixes). There will be relatively few bugs, because the packages
> released into stable will have been rigorously tested. There will be
> separate mailing lists in addition to the Debian mailing lists.
>
> Unlike Bruce's project - this project will have a symbiotic
> relationship with Debian. If it works, it will attract new users to
> the Debian code base. Also, the more successful Debian is, the more
> successful this subset of Debian will be.
>
> I'd like to see more people announce that they want to develop their
> own "subset" Linux distributions based on Debian. I'd be willing to
> collaborate on tools to make this easier.
>
> The big problem with Bruce's idea of developing yet another volunteer
> distribution is that he will once again have no control over what the
> volunteers will be doing. He'd be much better off using the same
> model I am going to use, which allows for near 100% editorial control,
> without giving up the benefits of having hundreds of developers
> feeding code in. Of course, if he wants to base a distribution on rpm
> rather than dpkg (bad idea, IMHO), he'd be better off basing his work
> on the Stampede distribution, and organizing a recruiting campaign for
> them.
>
> In summary, don't hold your breath for my "subset distribution" of
> Debian - it will take a long time to pull together. But I strongly
> believe that this is a model Debian should encourage.
>
> The Debian distribution "proper" may never have more market share than
> the commercial distributions such as Red Hat, Caldera, and SuSe.
> However, it is entirely possible that derivative subset distributions
> of Debian could dominate the Linux marketplace (especially given the
> technical superiority of Debian).
>
> Cheers,
>
> - Jim
>
>
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