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Re: [LONG] ppp-udeb: A succesful installation using it, some ideas and some requests for advices

On 5/16/06, Marco d'Itri <md@linux.it> wrote:
eddy.petrisor@gmail.com wrote:

>> No. DHCP and PPPoE support are not related.
>Err, this is a problem in the d-i intergration. D-I should prompt as
No, it's not. You use DHCP to configure the ethernet interface and then
use PPPoE for the ppp0 interface.

>few times as possible. The most usual/convenient case is to have a
>dhcp server on the network and to have all configuration information
>from that dhcp server. Currently D-I asks for manual configuration
>information in case DHCP fails. AFAICS, with the introduction of PPPoE
>configuration, manual configuration should be requested in case the
>PPPoE configuration fails, too (after the automatic identification of
No, it should always be requested and *before* any attempt to configure

>> > - if concentrator detection fails, drop to manual configuration
>> If no concentrator is detected then the interface does not support
>> PPPoE and there is no need or reason to configure anything.
>That is if you assume that I ment "manual PPPoE configuration", but I
>ment "static configuration" :-) of the Ethernet card.
Then it's something not related in any way to PPPoE support.
When you start probing for PPPoE the ethernet interface should already
have been configured.

>Is it possible to have a PPPoE configuration ran as in the following
> - configure the Ethernet card through DHCP
> - configure a ppp connection (PPPoE) over the Ethernet card
>configured at the previous step; the nameserver and default route are
>set through the PPP connection?
This is what I have been explaining you need to do.

>I was under the impression that on a PPPoE connection one will have
>always an Ethernet card (ethX) which is just up, but has no IP, and a
>pppY virtual interface which has an IP which is given by the PPP
>server. Is this picture not correct?
Yes. I already explained this multiple times. An IP address is not
*needed* on the ethernet interface, but always configuring one is
simpler and may prevent problems later.

If I am going to do that on the connection from my provider, I will
have my contract termitated in a second because I am not allowed to
use other IPs in their network than the ones given by thier servers,
and believe me, there is NO configuration given for the ethernet card.

This should explain my persistance in my position and the conclusions
I have came to.

Advice is awaited.

>> >is, when should the PPPoE configuration be attempted? It seems logical
>> After DHCP.
>After DHCP fails, right? Or?
After DHCP or manual configuration of the ethernet interface.

Or ifconfig ethX up with no IP, as in my case, so AFAICT, the postinst
should detect if an Ethernet card is up, and if it is, try to probe
for a concentrator. If the card is not yet up with an IP, the
ppp-udeb.postinst script should just up it, wiithout an IP. At least
that's how it seems logical to me.

>> >There is small issue, if the concentrator is searched on a card, then
>> >the card in question must be "ifconfig CARD up" with no IP, should
>> >this be restored if the concentrator is not found? Would it affect the
>> Wrong, the ethernet card should get a proper IP address. Network
>> interfaces used for PPPoE do not need any special configuration.
>I'm afraid your statements sound conflictive with each other.
>What I know is what happens here. The configuration supported by my
>provider works if I "ifconfig eth9 up" with the ethernet not having
>any IP and then start pppd so ppp0 is started.
You do not *need* an IP address on the interface but *should* have one.
And as you noticed, always configuring it is simpler.

No, I *have* observed that an "ifconfig ethX up" which will result in
a interface which is up, but has no IP, is enough for the probing to
happen correctly.

So the question remains, how does one determine which interfaces were
brought up by the ppp-udeb script (probably simple, as they might be
ones with no IP set) and which are they associated to (more difficult
for multiple ppp connections)? Bonus points for the association in
subsequent runs of the postinst.

>> >How can the configuration information be copied to the target system
>> >after the system is installed?
>> The udev script already does this.
>That is not possible because of various reasons;
It is if you do it correctly.

That's what I was asking for, help on how to do itm, because the
ppp-udeb postinst is ran too early to export the configuration into
the target system.

>I tested an installation and:
>1) the ppp related stuff was not installed by default
It is supposed to be.

by whom?

>2) the configuration of pppoe on the target system was not the same as
>the one in the d-i envronment.
I do not know what this means, but the d-i configuration will work in
the installed system as well.

The question is still "who will put the configuration there, in the
target system?".
This is a question which should be answered by d-i guys.

>3) it is not possible to copy the pppoe configuration on the target at
>the time the ppp-udeb postinst is ran because the system does not have
>yet configured the destination partition for /. (It is necessary to
Obviously you need to do it later.

"How?" that's what I was asking.

"Imagination is more important than knowledge" A.Einstein

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