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Re: revising the first cd contents...

[ Copying d-boot as well, we could do with some discussion here. ]

On Fri, Jun 18, 2004 at 11:45:37PM +0200, Santiago Garcia Mantinan wrote:
>We have a problem with the first cd as we don't even have any xserver there,
>so I'm trying to go through that and as I don't have much experience with
>deiban-cd code myself, I'll try to comment here things that look weird to me
>or that I think should be changed.
>The target should be to have really the packages we and our users want on
>the first cd, for example, Joey Hess wanted the desktop task to be
>available, but this task depends on both x-window-system-core, kde and
>gnome. Testing on a newly base installed bachine, tells me that installing
>desktop task needs to download 353 MB, and we know that our netinst cds
>(debian installer + base) is already 110 MB in size, adding them would mean
>465 megs, leaving almost 200 megs free for other stuff, not bad at all, but
>are this real numbers for our dear debian-cd? I don't think so.


>The thing is that on the netinst cds we just have the base stuff, but on
>full cds we have all the standard system, and also we add recommends and
>suggests, and also that we have a forcd1 task that adds stuff to cd1 and
>doesn't add the packages needed for the desktop task.

Hmmm. forcd1 doesn't seem to be particularly up to date; there's been
5 checkins in the last 12 months, and the last almost 4 months ago. Is
it still relevant? Maybe it needs restarting once we've worked out
what will fit...

>I have done some tests and we can have on our first cd both
>x-window-system-core, kde-core and gnome-core as well as all the stuff we
>add in forcd1 task, this is using normal options, adding recommends and
>suggests. Note that I added -core versions of kde and gnome, and not the
>full kde and gnome, which wouldn't fit. I don't know however if this would
>give good contents for this cd.
>Trying to add full kde and gnome (not the -core stuff) resulted on not
>fitting on the first cd, not even if I choose just kde or gnome and not
>both. This is however adding recommends and suggests.
>I've done some different tests, this are some numbers I got from them:
>Normal build (with recommends and suggests):
>Standard system already takes 481498058 bytes on the first CD.
>Trying to add x-window-system-core...
>$cd_size = 524856070, $size = 25958248
>Trying to add gnome-core...
>$cd_size = 550814318, $size = 81092036
>Trying to add kde-core...
>$cd_size = 631906354, $size = 10605184
>Modified build (without recommends and suggests):
>Standard system already takes 424595680 bytes on the first CD.
>Trying to add x-window-system-core...
>$cd_size = 500982974, $size = 25958248
>Trying to add gnome-core...
>$cd_size = 526941222, $size = 34316326
>Trying to add kde-core...
>$cd_size = 561257548, $size = 44965402
>As you can see, removing recommends and suggests get's us 36 megs of space
>on the first cd. The increment in size on adding kde-core to the modified
>build with respect to the normal build, is caused because in a normal build
>gnome's suggests and recommends pull a lot of thing on which kde depends,
>like qt.

OK. What about for a 700MB image? That might make it easier.

>Now a couple of comments and doubts I have on our builds:
>First one:
>When we build rawlist we do:
>        $(Q)if [ -x "/usr/sbin/debootstrap" -a _$(INSTALLER_CD) != _1 ]; then \
>                /usr/sbin/debootstrap --arch $(ARCH) --print-debs $(CODENAME) \
>                | tr ' ' '\n' >>$(BDIR)/rawlist; \
>        fi
>But then task base-sarge, included from Debian_sarge, is generated using:
>for arch in alpha arm i386 ia64 m68k powerpc sparc mips mipsel hppa s390
>    echo "#ifdef ARCH_$arch"
>    debootstrap --arch $arch --print-debs $CODENAME | tr ' ' '\n' | grep -v "^$"
>    echo "#endif"
>    echo ""
>So I'm asking myself if the data which is supposed to be included in
>base-sarge is not already included in rawlist and even more up to date as it
>is built on runtime not like base-sarge which dates from debootstrap 0.2.23,
>if so... why is base-sarge needed at all?

Good question. We need to work out which method to use, and just deal
with it. Maybe work from a package list generated by d-i and stored
somewhere in the archive? Joey?

>Second one:
>I have one question about this tasks, how is forcd1 generated?
>Is forcd1 for sarge? for any release?
>Shouldn't it be different for each release? maybe a name like forcd1-sarge
>and some purging, additions, reordering, ... here should be in place?

Definitely, IMHO.

>Third one:
>We are building with contrib, like we have done in the past, how about
>adding contrib just to the last media? after all main has gone in?
>I think this is not posible with current debian-cd, anybody wanting to make
>the modifications to allow this?

I'd just let popcon and/or dependencies deal with it, to be
honest. An example of useful stuff here would msttcorefonts; base
packages will suggest it for pretty fonts.

Steve McIntyre, Cambridge, UK.                                steve@einval.com
Support the Campaign for Audiovisual Free Expression: http://www.eff.org/cafe/

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