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Re: complaints about systemd

On Thu, 9 Oct 2014, Ray Andrews wrote:

From what I've read about the history and philosophy of all 'nix, I thought it was a bedrock rule that primary inputs and outputs *must* be text. Especially any sort of error log! To abandon that is to travel down the road to Redmond, is it not? Mr. Poettering seems to be a very clever lad, and it seems that some real deficiencies in the old init have been identified, and some real solutions offered, but it looks to me like systemd needs a sober re-think. Sometimes we really can be too clever for our own good.

I could not write it any better than this, I agree with every word. Also, I
have the same very annoying behaviour on several machines that shutdown
hangs forever (or for a very long time), and in the end I frequently end up
pushing the power button. This began to happen with systemd, and it is
horribly difficult to debug: shutdown hangs after syslog was stopped, so the
only way to get some decent debug info is (would have been in SystemV times)
have the scripts dump a lot of info in text files, and then read them. Now,
with systemd, how do you go about debugging this?

I second this: systemd has some good points, but the price tag is
unreasonably high.  And, most importantly, there should be some real choice,
it should not be as deeply embedded as a dependency into many completely
unrelated things: what does a desktop environment have to do with the init
system?  why on earth should gnome or any other desktop environment depend
on systemd and be somewhat broken, or even uninstallable, without it?

Had I wanted this kind of overclever stuff, in which everything "magically"
(sort of) works but at the price of being a nightmare to customize/debug, I
would have installed ubuntu, not debian!

Pretty please...


Giacomo Mulas <gmulas@oa-cagliari.inaf.it>

INAF - Osservatorio Astronomico di Cagliari
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