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Bug#685772: www.debian.org: Please clarify official/unofficial status of resources under http://www.debian.org/support

Package: www.debian.org
Severity: serious
As I don't familiar with Debian mail lists hierarchy I previously ask for
right place at:



But next pointed to this bug list:




I think that page:


MUST be reorganised in this way:

 * Make clarification on difference between official and non-official support
 * Split page on two part: first list official resources, second -
 * Remove some non-official resources.
 * Add link to http://wiki.debian.org/DebianResources

If my arguments non-valuable or my vote value low I ask only for:

 * Make clarification on difference between official and non-official support

I try to take arguments why doing so.


I think that page:


describe two things:

 1) how to get help on Debian topic
 2) channels of interaction between regular users and Debian project

While 1) goal is currently completed by this page 2) goal is partially broken
- this page doesn't take easy distinct what belong to Debian project.

Personally I think that all under *.debian.org are official. But this is my
assumption. Where I can find this kind of info?

I believe that most of people associate Debian with DFSG so I believe that
most of these people think that official Debian resources consistent with DFSG
(like avoiding discrimination, priorities on Debian users and free software,
and other parts from DFSG).


I don't know where stated official information about what are official Debian
resources for human interaction.

As I understand official resources are:

 * Debian documentation (txt, html, pdf)
 * Debian Wiki (wiki.debian.org)
 * Debian mailing lists (accessed from Google Groups (HTTP) or Gmane (NNTP))
 * Package Maintainers (<package name>@packages.debian.org, where I can find
   archive of these mails??)
 * Bug Tracking System (mail, HTTP)
 * IRC (irc.debian.org)

I think that http://www.debian.org/support is only one right place for such
king of info in current hierarchy of http://www.debian.org/...


Compare with this page:


which have column:

        Debian International
        Security Information
        Bug reports
        Mailing Lists
        Mailing List Archives

There are no links to non-official resources.


While some resources have term of use like:


but I don't find terms under another pages:


I try to look these keywords without success:

  term licence statement agreement FAQ contract

I don't discuss about legality of communication, licence issues or disclaimers
on these resources (but it is essential!! for example if wiki permission too
restrictive I can't copy example of configs, etc).

My point in that if page http://www.debian.org/support achieve goal:

 * Make clarification on difference between official and non-official support

we have sentences that describe what mean to be official resources.

This text must be harmonised with term of use of official resources.


When I say that goal

 1) how to get help on Debian topic

completed I miss one thing. http://www.debian.org/support point to 2 forums.


point to another 10x or so forums. I don't have statistics how often forums
are visited and how helpful they are but I think that non-listened forums
discriminated (they miss promotion from Debian home page, while other get).

Another point that http://www.debian.org/support is not editable (this is
good) but anyone who setup new Debian resource have difficulties (I can be
wrong) in adding it to http://www.debian.org/support (note that
wiki.debian.org is editable by anyone who interesting in changes).

If take together these two thought I think it is right make one of:

 * remove info about unnecessary non-official resources


 * state that "These resources ... are proved to be useful to Debian
   community. Also there are exist another {forums, wiki, etc. - select one},
   you can browse full list at:

This resolve two my proposals:

 * Remove some non-official resources.
 * Add link to http://wiki.debian.org/DebianResources


Example of possible harm which can come from users when they use non-official
resources is discussed at:

                thread about announce of http://forums.debian.net, but next
                critics about debianHELP forum

This post point to:

 * Conflict with DFSG in term of use of resources.
 * Meta-site, mix of forums, FAQs, books, links, any you want...
 * Different branding and styling from official.
 * Ads on resources.

So any non-official resource can conflict with DFSG, potentially can make harm
to users, and what sad http://www.debian.org/support promotes this resource!

Best regards!

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