Re: Question to candidates: what are your quantitative diversity goals and metrics?
Hi Andreas,
Thank you for responding to my question.
On Thu, Mar 28, 2024 at 07:28:52AM +0100, Andreas Tille wrote:
>
> We are all aware of the issue you are eloquently illustrating. I will
> not make false promises and give any metrics I intend to reach as DPL.
> The reason behind the current metrics are well known problems in our
> world. As DPL I do not have the power to make the world a better place.
> The DPL task is making Debian a better place for discriminated people
> and I love to work together with Sruthi on this - no matter who will be
> elected.
>
Very well.
Let me ask a follow-up question.
>From your platform: "Currently, there is a notable over representation
of male contributors originating from countries typically considered
industrialized."
If you refuse to give any quantitative goals or metrics that you intend
to reach as DPL, then could you explain how you quantify the *current*
state of Debian in the area of diversity? That is, precisely what do you
mean by the above statement from your platform?
You mention in your reply, "The reason behind the current metrics are
well known problems in our world." Perhaps, but could you be clear about
which particular metrics are the problem at the moment?
I can infer that you likely view the current ratio of around 3% women
(33/1004) and around 96% men ((1004-33)/1004) [0] (and, yes, I recognize
that this does not account for gender minority individuals, but I was
not able to locate figures for that group). However, what is not clear
is at what point, in your own view, the situation is imbalanced. Would
you consider 65% men, 25% women, and 10% gender minority to have an
overrepresentation of men? What about 40% men, 45% women, and 15% gender
minority? Or what about 20% men, 30% women, and 50% gender minority?
The situation for geographic diversity is certainly much more difficult
to describe. For instance, we have some information on the locations of
Debian Developers [1]. But is someone's "location" the same as their
citizenship, or their nationality, or their ethnic origin? And which of
these dimensions should be the focus or primary factor?
The point is that the judgment "this is imbalanced" conveys as much
meaning as "this is beautiful" or "this is ugly". However, while
qualitative judgments may be appropriate in qualitative situations and
while they may help initiate the converstion in quantitative situations,
qualitative judgments are not useful for measuring and improving
quantitative situations. Else, you could say "there is a notable over
representation of male contributors" and I could say "there is a notable
*underrepresentation* of male contributors" and there would be no
meaningful way to decide which is the more valid statement. Just as how
looking at a work of art one person could say "this is beautiful" and
another "this is ugly" and we would find ourselves at the same sort of
impasse.
You also mention in your reply, "As DPL I do not have the power to make
the world a better place." I think that the DPL does have some ability
to influence the world. However, the DPL has an even greater ability to
shape the project. You claim that the current state is problematic, so
it seems reasonable that there is some underlying criteria that causes
you to reach the conclusion "this is a problem".
In any event, rather than infer what you might believe, I thought it
more respectful and helpful to ask you give some insight into how you
shaped your view so that those who consider voting for you might
understand how you would like to reshape the Debian project.
Regards,
-Roberto
[0] https://wiki.debian.org/DebianWomen/Projects/Statistics
[1] https://www.debian.org/devel///developers.loc.en.html
--
Roberto C. Sánchez
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