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Who would you expel from Debian? (Was: Re: Candidate questions: expulsions process)

On Sun, Mar 12, 2006 at 03:44:28AM +0000, Matthew Garrett wrote:
Murdock Ray <mjr@phonecoop.coop> wrote:
If you want to debate grand ideas: What role should socio-religious
views play in the Debian project?  Would using differences in beliefs
about death as a motive to call for expulsion (as threatened in
http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2006/01/msg00929.html and
explained in
http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2006/01/msg00968.html ) be good
for Debian if it happens? If it's OK to expel some DDs for holding
minority beliefs and therefore improve the cultural homogeneity of
the project, what beliefs should it be done for?  On Deaths? Births?
Sexuality? Churches? Prayer? Business ethics?

For those who can't read -private, Andrew's claims are untrue -
objections are voiced due to the manner in which Andrew voiced his
beliefs, not the beliefs in and of themselves. Nobody believes that
Andrew should be expelled from the project because he believes that
death should be a celebration of the fact that somebody is no longer
constrainted by their mortality. People believe that Andrew should be
expelled because he managed to turn a simple notice of the death of a
Debian contributor into a several hundred message flamewar.

Good heavens.  You think a several hundred message flamewar is just
cause for ejecting a developer from the project?  What about a thousand
message flame war?  A flame-war takes two or more to keep going; how
would you decide who was the guilty party?  The one who you liked the

Speaking as a DPL candidate, I do not view flame-wars as any sort of
cause for expulsion of a developer.  Everyone has their disagreements
from time to time, and in a diverse project like Debian, deep-seated
notions from opposite sides of the continuum are guaranteed to pop up
and conflict from time to time.

I think the other DPL candidates, especially Steve McIntyre who has been
pussy-footing around this issue, should stand forward and say clearly
where they stand on the issue of expelling developers; what is a just
case for expulsion?  Be really clear and specific.  Give concrete

Have all the other DPL candidates been vague on this topic because they
have specific Debian members in mind that they would like to expel as
soon as they are voted in to power?

I only know of two expulsions in Debians history. Both happened many
years ago, and I supported both of them. One was of a developer who
started erasing the Debian archives to erase some embarassing remarks he
made on the mailing lists.  The other was a developer who attempted to
use our servers to launch DDoS attacks.

Physically compromising the security and dependability of our servers
and archives is cause for removal.  So is using our servers to
compromise the security and reliability of anyone elses machinery.  I
see no other cause for removal.


It's not true unless it makes you laugh, but you don't understand it until it makes you weep.

Eukleia: Ted Walther
Address: 5690 Pioneer Ave, Burnaby, BC  V5H2X6 (Canada)
Contact: 604-430-4973

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