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Re: NM process (was: Question to all candidates about the NM process)



Le Mar 7 Mars 2006 12:59, Frank Küster a écrit :
> Bill Allombert <allomber@math.u-bordeaux.fr> wrote:
> > My own opinion is that if an applicant is doing a sizable job in
> > Debian already, they should be exempted of much of T&S. They have
> > shown the skill to do the work they are more likely to do anyway,
> > and they will have time to learn new skills as they need them. That
> > might speed up the process a bit.
> […]
> However, I did learn a lot both in the T&S and P&P (philosophy and
> procedures, or what's the name) part of the process, most importantly
> about library handling (which became important with the
> libkpathsea3->4 transition), evaluating licenses (which is important
> now, see the several bugs on the tetex-base source package) and
> internal structure of a binary package (knowledge which I seem to use
> every week).
>
> Not that I couldn't have learned that also later, when I really
> needed it.  But the NM process was in fact a good opportunity to
> learn it right, get immediate feedback on my achievements (and not
> via the BTS...), and to take it serious.

I agree with that. What is really painful in the NM queue, as I lived 
it, is the time between the steps [1]:
 [Received application] -> [Application Manager Assigned]

and between :
 [Appliaction Manager recommends to DAM] -> Account Created.

I took my NM that is quite recent as an example. It took me almost a 
YEAR (like in 11 monthes) to have my account:

almost 3 monthes to have an AM
2 days to pass T&S and P&P
5 days more because of a mail of mine, stuck on an SMTP
exactly 8 monthes (WTF !?!?!) to have then my account created.


The pain in the NM queue, is that motivated candidates just can't make 
it in a couple of weeks, or monthes. I know I was in the NM queue where 
it was in the worst shape ever. but you can take recent DD's to see it 
has not changed much (totally random, see [2] e.g. total application 
took 11 monthes too for a T&S+P&P of less than a month).

and the statistics are here to confirm what I say (see [3]) :
                        Mode  Median Average   Max  (in days)
Awaiting AM assignment  196    190     182     217
Awaiting DAM Approval   155    211     195     287

in the NM queue, you (in average) pass 374 days doing ... well ... 
nothing. I know you can still package things, and so on, but during 
more than a YEAR, you don't see the god**** queue move, and *that's* 
the horrible part in it.

Maybe it's a good idea to have the NM wait a bit in the queue, to "test" 
his motivation. But at least this should be advertised by us (instead 
of suffered by the NM) and the 6month to process and validate the 
applications is just too much. If it's not humanly feasible to validate 
application in less than half a year, then the process has to be 
rethought so that with the human ressource we have to process 
applicants, we can do it in a reasonnable delay.

skip T&S for "already known applicants" won't change anything to the 
time you pass in the queue. not noticeably anyway.

 [1] https://nm.debian.org/nmstatus.php?email=pierre.habouzit%40m4x.org
 [2] https://nm.debian.org/nmstatus.php?email=lool%40dooz.org
 [3] https://nm.debian.org/
-- 
·O·  Pierre Habouzit
··O                                                madcoder@debian.org
OOO                                                http://www.madism.org

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