Re: There is no choice

[Rob Owens <rowens@ptd.net>]

----- Original Message -----
> From: "Chris Bannister" <cbannister@slingshot.co.nz>
> 
> On Mon, Sep 22, 2014 at 09:04:05PM +0100, Joe wrote:
> > On Mon, 22 Sep 2014 17:56:10 +0000
> > "Andrew M.A. Cater" <amacater@galactic.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> > > 
> > > It woun't kill any detractors to try this and help us find what
> > > breaks, to help us to get a Debian system we can all be proud of
> > > instead of talking up a storm to complain about things. Experience
> > > may also allow us to support alternatives where feasible.
> > > 
> > Why is it forbidden to do both? I need to use Windows for some
> > purposes, and occasionally I even correct some of the more out-of-date
> > FUD about it, but that doesn't mean I think it's great, or that I'm
> > somehow not allowed to criticise it.
> 
> No, but consider how it would go down if you were a Farmer who wasn't
> happy with the crop yield but instead of going to the seed manufacturer
> you go along to the tractor service department and complain incessantly.
> How do you think that would go down?
> 

I get your point, but don't the Debian developers have a better chance of getting changes implemented in upstream systemd that I do?  Keep in mind, I'm not a developer, so I can't provide patches.  All I can do is explain the problems some of systemd's design choices are causing me.  These problems may be related to function, or the may be related to something else such as limitation of choice or freedom.  

In any case, I sort of look to the Debian developers as my representatives.  Maybe that's not how they view themselves, I don't know.  But I would hope that they care more about the needs of a Debian user than the upstream systemd guys do.  It seems doubtful that the upstream systemd guys are ever going to be convinced to change their design to separate the init system from all the other features that systemd provides.  But resistance from Debian the distro would go a lot farther than resistance from a bunch of users who can't contribute code anyway.

So in my dream world, I would explain to the Debian devs why the systemd design (bundling too much functionality into an init system) causes problems for the user.  They would understand my points and be sympathetic.  They would then apply pressure to upstream to make changes, possibly to include submitting patches.

Some may say that I'm asking others to do the work for me.  But the work isn't all in the fixing.  Identifying the problem and understanding the causes takes work, too.  So does caring enough to report the problems.

-Rob