Re: Why is troubleshooting Linux so hard?
Jesús;
Your argument is bogus, how many threads do you sit on and are you arguing about this? How many OS's are you trying to convince???
What you seem to be missing, and has been pointed out over and over is yes Debian as a Distribution is developed by volunteers, yes you can go around trying to make demands, but in reality all your gonna get is told to go do unholy things to yourself. Yeah you can choose to exclude packages or software for whatever reason, but the it wouldn't be much of an OS would it??
Sure you can do a lot of things, but if you want 100% idiot proof, go with windows, they specialize in dumbing things down.
Linux as well as most open source software is written for effectiveness by the coders who wish to use it. They are taking their free time to collaborate on projects, doing what they would otherwise be paid to do.
The fact is that most developers in the linux and FOSS world don't care if you can get their code working on your system or not. They provide it free of charge and without warranty. If it works for you, good we're glad, if not, we'll see if we can help. But complaining and biting isn't gonna get you anywhere because when it comes down to it, nobody's gonna loose sleep that somebody couldn't use their code.
I don't mean to flame, but this conversation just keeps going back and forth, back and forth. I think your time would be better spent learning and studying, figuring out why your google results are limited, what you can change to maybe find more relevant info, or what search engines may be otherwise helpful. Maybe studying the linux system as a whole to understand what, why, and how, it's doing what it does.
Bottom line: why is linux so difficult? Because it's freaking free. It is written by the very PHd Canadits you speak of, and their number one interest is that it works for them. If you can gain and work it, learn from it, excellent, a lot of people are willing to help you. If you want your hand held, well you gotta pay for that. Either microsoft or maybe a distro that offers trouble ticket licenses (like red hat enterprise or suse enterprise)
TeddyB
-----Original Message-----
From: "Jesús M. Navarro" <jesus.navarro@undominio.net>
Date: Wed, 17 Nov 2010 15:38:35
To: <debian-user@lists.debian.org>
Subject: Re: Why is troubleshooting Linux so hard?
Hi, Steve:
On Monday 15 November 2010 21:34:03 Steve Kemp wrote:
[...]
> Debian policy wouldn't arbitrarily try to mandate how the software
> we include is written because we simply have no control over that.
Not to state a position but I think what you say's basically irrelevant:
Debian has no control about how people distribute their software either but
still Debian strongly stablishes that "these" kind of licenses are acceptable
while "those" kind of licenses are not.
It would be absolutly within Debian abilities to stablish, say, that only
software developed in C were to be acceptable (to name just the stupidest
thing that it came to my mind).
> Sure we can and do patch some software, but to implement your
> suggestion we'd have to patch many many many pieces of unrelated
> software and that is not a simple thing.
Again, that's just in line with other things already being done: packaging
10.000 "programs" it's not a simple thing either but that's exactly what
Debian does.
> Nor would maintaining those patches be easy.
Only those that weren't accepted upstream should have to be maintained.
> (Not that I disapprove of your general idea; but consider would *you*
> personally download the source to 100 applications, update them to log
> in a consistent fashion, post the patches to the appropriate project's
> discussion lists (if they even exist), then keep them updated for
> a year or two? Even if you did who would handle the other few
> thousand application binaries..)
Consider would *you* personally download the source to 100 applications,
massage them so they are acceptable within Debian policy bounds, etc. then
keept them updated for a year or two?
Well, that's exactly what Debian does while, obviously, being an impossibility
for you alone, so it seems you have a non-argument.
Cheers.
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