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Re: [lowliest priority help] needed for Apache in Debian stable

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On Thu, Apr 10, 2003 at 03:04:08AM +0000, C Masters wrote:
> I have received cc'd mails reminding me that Debian is a volunteer 
> supported community. I accept this fully, and realize that I will not 
> get immediate responses. However, I am sure that I am not alone in 
> experiencing severe frustration when a previously well-working 
> application, listed as a "stable" package, no longer behaves as it had. 

It sometimes happens in stable.  Not often, but if you find an obscure
enough use that hasn't been as well tested as other functionality that
everybody uses, things can get weird.

> I find it a tad "superior" to hear the constant responses of "wait, 
> we're all volunteers" and "if you don't like it, build it yourself" that 
> has been lurking here of late.

Why?  This attitude isn't anywhere near exclusive to debian-user, nor
is it widely accepted as a sign of a collective superiority complex.
There have been instances where people have been both clueless and
pretentious enough to deliberately EMP (excessivly multi-post) the
list and assign themselves a priority (that's the reader's job, not
the sender's, whether we're talking snail mail or email) then come off
far less intelligently than you have when people have tried to provide
basic clue.

> IMHO, community refers not only to the members of a group, but the 
> collective actions ~of~ that group. I would hope that maintainers and 
> power users can recall the day when they were still newbies, even though 
> they felt comfotable building, debugging, and generally going CLI crazy.

Yeah, and we got the same treatment and later discovered why it gets
handed down the way it does.

> I can find no explanation for the change in ~my~ installation of apache 
> other than these problems occured only ~after~ a regular upgrade on a 
> stable system. I am still mystified and was hoping that the maintainer 
> for apache would see my post.

The developers don't often read debian-user, this list has more
traffic than a good portion of them have time for.  This list exists
to relieve them of having to muck through support issues that don't
necissarily take a maintainer to answer.  This isn't to say the
maintainers are disconnected from what's going on, it's just
maintaining a package and making a real effort at user-end support are
equally time-consuming.  Contrary to popular belief, hackers have
lives, too.  8:o)

Consider this the Fodor's Travel Guide to any technically oriented
mailing list or newsgroup.

> I know ... I know ... file a bug on bugzilla. Yep, that works well for 
> those bugs that the ~maintainer~ believes to be important, which may or 
> may not be the opinion shared by the bug filer.

Bugzilla's appropriate for Mozilla bugs...I think using the BTS would
be more appropriate for everything Debian.  When filing a bug,
provide *lots* of proof it is a bug.  If it's an error in the default
config, correct it and submit it with your bug report.

- -- 
 .''`.     Baloo Ursidae <baloo@ursine.dyndns.org>
: :'  :    proud Debian admin and user
`. `'`
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fix a system
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