Re: X - window manager - desktop
-- Bruce Park <bpark79@hotmail.com> wrote
(on Friday, 08 November 2002, 01:01 PM -0500):
> >From: Paul Johnson <baloo@ursine.dyndns.org>
> >To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
> >Subject: Re: X - window manager - desktop
> >Date: Thu, 7 Nov 2002 23:06:00 -0800
> >
> >On Fri, Nov 08, 2002 at 01:35:33AM -0500, Bruce Park wrote:
> >> the X? What exactly is a window manager? twm, enlightment, sawfish ... I
> >
> >The window manager handles things like window title bars, resizing,
> >and other basic window elements. You can run X without a window
> >manager, though you won't be able to manipulate windows easy or as
> >extensively as you can with a window manager.
> >
> So window manager is optional but not really necessary?
Yes, optional... but only marginally so. It's pretty difficult to
manipulate windows otherwise.
> >> Then there is the desktop like gnome or kde which are just desktops. Can
> >> anyone explain this to me?
> >
> >Desktop environments sit above the window manager similar to how
> >window managers sit above X. The desktop environment provides things
> >like iconic drag and drop representation of your filesystem, usually a
> >Windows/Macish toolbelt, etc., oriented towards being a replacement to
> >actually using the command line. Some people find desktop
> >environments useful, I find them slow, bloated and a shiny, chrome
> >waste of space. YMMV.
> >
> Paul, I too find having a desktop unnecessary. I do prefer using the
> command line most of the time because it's quicker. By the time I reach for
> my mouse, I've already wasted a good second when I could have type 5 or
> more characters. The reason why I want a desktop is purely for its looks.
> other times, I may use nautilus to peek at a page with 2 files and I dont'
> know which is which. Sure I can use a UNIX command to do this but sometimes
> this is easier and neater. Another reason why I like to have it is because
> I love having multiple emacs windows open. I usually open 2 files in one
> window and have about 2 more windows open when I'm developing software.
> Here, the mouse comes in handy but thats because I haven't gotten used
> using the alt-tab key yet.
So, if you find most items on a desktop unnecessary and don't use
them... use *just* a window manager. I operate pretty similarly to you,
from what you describe. I use blackbox as a window manager. I utilize a
file manager called ROX-filer (http://rox.sourceforge.net) that runs in
a minimal amount of memory, loads *very* quickly, and can even display
small thumbnails of images (it can also place icons on your desktop, if
you're so inclined). I have gkrellm running along the left side
of my screen, and it tells me when I have new mail, allows me to set
alarms, and can control the volume from my soundcard when I listen to
music. I have a pager, mainly so I can see which desktop I'm on and
relative locations of windows. And I utilize aterm a *lot*, including
one large, decoration-less and transparent aterm in one workspace that
runs screen (which allows me to do most of my work in a single term,
including mail reading, news reading, midnight commander, and vim).
Basically, you get a window manager, and then decide which applications
you want to use and get them, instead of grabbing an entire desktop
environment and its related applications. Many, if not most, window
managers are capable of utilizing gnome and kde apps *without* loading
gnome or kde over themselves. It's a nice way to reduce the number of
applications you have on your system as well as memory overhead.
> Now for my next question, do desktops such as gnome and kde require a
> specific version of window manager?
So, I'm obviously prejudiced here -- I don't think you need gnome and
kde -- just the libraries necessary to run whatever apps from these
desktop environments you find necessary.
BUT, if you decide to go the desktop environment route... It depends
largely on which version of either you choose to use. The more recent
versions of each require (or prefer) a netwm enabled window manager --
netwm is a newer standard for how window managers accept commands from
applications and desktop environments. From what I remember, both have
configuration tools that detect compatible window managers on your
system and allow you to both enable and configure them. If you need a
list of window managers, do an "apt-cache search 'window manager'" and
weed through the list; there are also places on the web that have
reviews of different ones (can't tell you any off the top of my head,
though).
--
Matthew Weier O'Phinney
matthew@weierophinney.net
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