I got IceWM and Gnome to play together nicely, after a lot of waiting and updating... one thing that bugs me is that it keeps creating windows at the 0,0 coordinate, right on top of my panel. Any ideas how to make smart placement, uh, smarter?? Thanks. -- Jonathan Markevich <jonathan@markevich.ourfamily.com> http://members.xoom.com/JMarkevich What this country needs is a good five cent ANYTHING!