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Re: PINE Debian Package

>>"George" == George Bonser <grep@oriole.sbay.org> writes:

George> The way it has always been understod was that the "main"
George> portion of the distribution would always be 100% free.
George> Non-free stuff goes in non-free and stuff that is free but
George> depends on non-free stuff goes in contrib.

	That is entirely correct.

George> If Debian wants to make non-free a source-only archive, it is
George> going to greatly increase my costs for installing systems
George> because I happen to be a fan of quite a few things in there.

	Please, stop this FUD. Debian is not thinking of making
 non-free a source only distribution. Except where it is illegal for
 us to ship binaries. Like Qmail. There are lots of packages in
 non-free as .deb files. We even make it easy to install qmail on your
 machine, compiling during the install. So the commitment from Debians
 side has noit changed. We just discovered that we were doing
 something illegal (or close enough to desist).

George> Yes, our fault.  If any distribution of software takes a
George> political stand and alienates half of its users or makes the
George> distribution more difficult to use or more difficult to
George> configure and it looses a significant number of its users and
George> fails to attract new users at the rate it did before, it soon
George> fades into insignificance.

	Well, we are sorry, but Debian does take a political stand. We
 are commited to freedom of software. Our contention is theat, by and
 large, that also means no compromise on quality. Technicall, I prefer
 Emacs+gnus or mutt to pine. And mutt is an alternative. 

	Yes, free software may have less features or a steeper learnig
 curve. Debian is still committed to it.

	I do apologize for the inconvenience our convitions are
 causeing you.

George> Choosing it simply because it is politically correct is not
George> going to happen except for a few zelots.

	Us ``zelots'' are content. Unlike brother bill, we are not in
 it for world domination or market share. We are in it cause it
 pleases our muse. We are in it for the community, and that means the
 community of people who suppoirt and ratify the DFSG and the
 principles behind it.
George> I thought the rise and fall of world socialism taught you
George> that.

	I prefer that to the Laisse Faire approacjh of putting 6 year
 olds in mines since the tunnels were smaller. ``Nobody is forcing the
 childen towork in my mines"

	There. Two non-sequetors in sequence.

George> You might provide a free application but if it sucks or
George> if there is a better non-free one available, guess which one
George> will get used.

	Depends on the person, I guess.

George> If you think making the non-free one more difficult to obtain
George> will drive development toward the free application, you are
George> making a flawed decision.

	Gues ncftpp did not get released under the GPL after all, huh?
 Anyway, you gotta understand what makes the developers tick too. We
 are in it for our ideals, nt for themoney. People can't afford my
 rates ;-)

George> People will simply expend more energey to get the better
George> product and if they have to do it too often will call your
George> product junk because it requires the expense of too much
George> energy to get the good applications.

	We can not control what people call our product. We put ot,
 for free, what we believe in and want to work on. People make their
 own decisions. 

George> Amazing how Netscape's release turns RMS from crackpot to
George> saint, isn't it?

	You call us crackpots, you label us communists (I think in
 your mind that is pejorative, for some strange reason), and you
 expect us to cntinue this discussion civilly?


 This conjunction of an immense military establishment and a large
 arms industry is now in the American experience... We must not fail
 to comprehend its grave implications... We must guard against the
 acquisition of unwarranted influence...by the military-industrial
 complex.  The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power
 exists and will persist. Dwight D. Eisenhower, from his farewell
 address in 1961
Manoj Srivastava  <srivasta@acm.org> <http://www.datasync.com/%7Esrivasta/>
Key C7261095 fingerprint = CB D9 F4 12 68 07 E4 05  CC 2D 27 12 1D F5 E8 6E

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