On Fri, Aug 15, 2025 at 01:01:13AM +0800, Blair Noctis wrote: [snip] > > Now here is the real question. WHY? Personally I am one of the people who always > > get the short end of the stick with meeting timings past midnight and whatnot, > > but still turn up nonetheless. I *might have* joked about this before, but never > > complained. That is because I understand there is not a single timezone that fits > > everyone. And I also understand we always have more people from europe, so it's > > easier to work with european timezones. > > Thus rendering me (and you) as the minority. > And I feel quite content asserting my "minority rights". > Just kidding, though I do wish to stay late less. Sleep is sweet. I do remember you being from similar timezones, but wasn't entirely sure. It is perfectly reasonable that we get to speak up :p [snip] > And your observations echo with my opinions in another of my replies. I'll > just be the bad guy and say the word: the meeting is sometimes practically > useless (in terms of decision making). It "degrades" to a virtual meet-up > where a few of the team members exchange news, talk about personal plans, > and that's it. No decision making on the team level. If all we expect from a > meeting is so, is it necessary for all the formality? > > Ultimately, I opened this thread assuming the meeting should be able to > conclude with team wide decisions. If that's wrong, just ignore this thread > and carry on. Now this brings up one of the real problems. We don't have several people sharing a lot of the important work within the team. f_g takes care of the toolchain, and plugwash (as well as NoisyCoil these days, and you - ncts - and wedahias maybe) does a lot of the heavy lifting. Everyone (/me included) has a lot of opinions, but ultimately what it means is that we need their opinions in most cases, especially f_g. So these meetings just about become hard dependencies on these people. Whether we reach a decision with them there is yet another matter though. But nonetheless, I feel like what me might need to fix first is the share the workload a bit among ourselves slowly so that we can work anything else out. If we can't make at least semi authoritative arguments, then there is no point in meetings to begin with. A simple note that other teams like python, ruby, go, etc. get by just fine without meetings. [snip] > > It is sort of nice that we are trying to find solutions for this people problem, but > > after more than enough discussions on this topic, now this just feels like bikeshedding. > > I don't quite agree with this. Bikeshedding means we mostly know it's not > worth it, and, in the source of that word, the subject is mostly subjective. > (The latter is not necessarily true for every case.) This case, on the other > hand, is worth it: there is a real problem, we are trying to solve it. The > subject itself is fairly subjective (people have different feelings), but > the problem is objective (misalignment of time slots, with real life > impact). I choose a bit hardshwords specifically to show how tired I am from us having so many discussions about how to have discussions, #sorrynotsorry. -- Best, Ananthu
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