Re: Developers vs Uploaders
On Thu, 15 Mar 2007, Clint Adams wrote:
> > Instead, will you please explain what you believe would be the advantages to
> > the *project* that "demoting" many DDs would bring?
> Fairness in the power structure. It would also seem honorable to give
How about going after "Try hard to improve things, but don't shake the house
too much while at it"? There is a "cost" to improving things, and if you
have to disturb everyone to do it, then that cost is high. It may not be
So don't expect everyone to look favourably to painful changes in name of
some idealistic fairness, unless that fairness brings advantages to the
project that are worth its cost. And it is *very* fair to ask you, the
proponent of the change, to list these advantages.
Give us reasons why those changes are worth their cost, i.e. why they would
be an advantage to the project. Otherwise, please kindly drop the subject.
If everyone did things this way, we would have far less worthless pain going
around this project. Not that you have caused any worthless pain in this
thread, mind you, and it has not degraded to a flamewar, either. I am not
singling you out or anything like that.
> DMs a partial weighted vote (I believe three-fifths of one vote has
> some negative connotations, so I'm not sure which number to suggest).
I (and a lot of other people) would like to give everyone that really
participates in Debian full DD voting privileges. This means translators,
documentation people, and others that have no business getting anywhere
close to the package archive (unless they are *also* packaging DDs, of
course, which is often true), but who *are* contributors to the Debian
We want to make them DDs, in fact. But we recognize the need for different
types of DDs (with the same voting rights, AND access to debian-private)
with different access permissions to be able to do it. Until the access
constelations are fine-grained enough, we will have to keep NM as a
packaging DD test, and refuse anyone that can't package properly.
The new functionality aj announced is a step in that direction of more
fine-grained access constelations, IMHO.
> Or do we want to communicate the message that your opinion counts if
> you have your name in the maintainer field of a single package that
> you haven't touched in three years because we "trust" you, but doesn't
> count if you've said nasty things about the DPL while you were in the
> NM queue, despite the work you've done?
Yes, we do. I don't know about the "said nasty things about the DPL" part,
but the rest of your "message" describes exactly how things *are* right now.
And that's exactly what we should be communicating.
OTOH, if you want to work to change the way things *are*, you're welcome and
you will find you will not be alone in that endeavour. But do promote only
changes that are worth the cost, please.
So can we have some real advantages for mass demotions, now? Or can we drop
the subject until such a time when someone has them and posts them here?
"One disk to rule them all, One disk to find them. One disk to bring
them all and in the darkness grind them. In the Land of Redmond
where the shadows lie." -- The Silicon Valley Tarot