Re: Reforming the NM process
Marc,
thank you very much for the well thought out writing.
On Tue, Apr 11, 2006 at 06:40:34PM +0200, Marc 'HE' Brockschmidt wrote:
> 1.1.1 Applicants
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Some applicants start the NM process with a wrong impression of the
> amount of time needed to finish successfully.
I don't think the amount of time that one needs to invest into the NM
process is clear from reading nm.debian.org. A few NMs who I sponsor
packages for complain that it will probably take up to one year until they
are through with it. Of course it's more frustrating if you think you can
get through within a month and are impatient. IMHO the NM process should be
treated as an acoompanying process while the NM is still contributing - so
the waiting time isn't too bad. Just maintaining a package as an "alibi" to
get into NM process and then doing nothing but answering the AM's questions
will be unsatisfying. And it will add one more to the list of MIA
developers.
> 1.1.2 Application Managers
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> The lack of free Application Managers that led to the accumulation of
> applicants waiting for an AM is mostly based on the fact that many
> developers don't care about the NM process, so only a few people are
> actually helping out.
I'm personally interested in the NM process. Just that I think I lack
deeper knowledge in some aspects that are necessary to become an AM. E.g. I
haven't yet packaged a library or worked in deep detail with the autotools
just to name examples. While it may appear that most DDs just ignore the
idea that they should consider becoming an AM perhaps they don't think they
are skilled enough for it. It's not (only) the convenience.
> A lack of motivation also affects the actual processing of applications,
> AMs are sometimes unresponsive in regard to NM things because they're
> too frustrated to actually sit down and finish the applications for NM
> they've accepted. They also don't reflect on this unresponsiveness and
> (almost) never ask for help or a substitute.
Motivation is surely a problem. Unfortunately I only got to know the NM
side of things so far (not only from my own historical experience - also
from other applicants) and in many cases the applicant was pretty
responsive but had to wait weeks for a reply from the AM. I'm not sure what
the problems were. Too many NMs simultaneously per AM? Too small timeslots
for the NM process? I can imagine that being an AM is often tedious.
Perhaps putting applicants on hold quicker would work in favor of the
active applicants.
> 1.2.3 Drop Front Desk/merge with DAM
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> The opinion that the FD check of reports is not needed has been
> presented more than once. Assuming this would be a real possibility, it
> would leave the problems not related to the DAM/FD unfixed.
I don't claim to know how the NM works backstage. But from my naive view
why can't it be like this:
The AM checks the applicant and decides whether the applicant is ready to
become a DD. The AM then either drops the applicant or tells the DAM to
create the account. No report needs to be written by the AM which is just
read by the FD and DAM. That way the AM would be more motivated by the
higher level of responsibility and by no need to write a report about it.
And all we read is a personal introduction from the applicant.
> 1.2.5 More than one AM per applicant
IMHO that just creates overhead. If an AM gets into a situation where the
necessary time for the applicant is missing then another AM could deal with
the applicant.
> 1.2.6 Web-based checks
Not good. Especially because I trust the AMs to do some checks about social
hygiene. The writing style, the movitation, the working style... all that
needs to be considered. It's not just multiple-choice.
> 2. Possible solutions
> =====================
>
> 2.1 Multiple advocates
> ----------------------
Very good idea. That would mean the applicant has to work with more than
just one DD. So i second that.
> 2.2 Requiring (more) work before applying
> -----------------------------------------
A DD whose opinion I value a lot once said: "To become a DD it's helpful
(if not mandatory) to already be part of the project - not become one while
being in the NM process." If the applicant has the right expectations it's
likely more joyful for both parties.
Christoph
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