Re: Bug#228486: Apology to german users required in the release notes
- To: Thomas Bushnell BSG <tb@becket.net>
- Cc: Mario Lang <mlang@debian.org>, 228486@bugs.debian.org, debian-release@lists.debian.org, debian-l10n-german@lists.debian.org, 235759@bugs.debian.org
- Subject: Re: Bug#228486: Apology to german users required in the release notes
- From: Michael Stone <mstone@debian.org>
- Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2004 17:33:22 -0400
- Message-id: <[🔎] 20040831213322.GF24269@mathom.us>
- Mail-followup-to: Michael Stone <mstone@debian.org>, Thomas Bushnell BSG <tb@becket.net>, Mario Lang <mlang@debian.org>, 228486@bugs.debian.org, debian-release@lists.debian.org, debian-l10n-german@lists.debian.org, 235759@bugs.debian.org
- In-reply-to: <[🔎] 878ybvc8mv.fsf@becket.becket.net>
- References: <[🔎] 20040831105946.GW24269@mathom.us> <[🔎] 87isaz8ibq.fsf@lexx.delysid.org> <[🔎] 20040831151710.GX24269@mathom.us> <[🔎] 87u0uj6u2p.fsf@lexx.delysid.org> <[🔎] 20040831190053.GA24269@mathom.us> <[🔎] 87n00bdrs1.fsf@becket.becket.net> <[🔎] 20040831202703.GB24269@mathom.us> <[🔎] 87wtzfcakj.fsf@becket.becket.net> <[🔎] 20040831210733.GC24269@mathom.us> <[🔎] 878ybvc8mv.fsf@becket.becket.net>
On Tue, Aug 31, 2004 at 02:14:48PM -0700, Thomas Bushnell BSG wrote:
Actually that's not a "real technical reason". If you could point to
a package with a bug that would be a serious problem if people used
UTF-8, then that would be a real technical reason. But saying "it
isn't required for sarge" doesn't mean that it actually doesn't
*work*.
I didn't say it did. I pointed to a potential problem. For all I know,
in an exclusively german context UTF-8 won't cause problems at all. What
I did say is that full multibyte compliance isn't guaranteed. That's a
fact. Now, those suggesting that a bunch of people who aren't currently
using UTF-8 suddenly start using it should look at the current state of
affairs and decide whether that's a good idea. IOW, is the quote issue a
big enough problem that we should suggest that all german users by
default use a less tested environment? I would suggest that those
proposing the change bear some responsibility for testing that
configuration from scratch to see what kind of impact it might have on a
new user's experience, compared to the current mode of operation. If
someone were to do that in a comprehensive fashion then I'd have no
question at all about the proposed change--but I doubt there's really
time for that given the number of packages in sarge.
FWIW, I use a UTF-8 locale on sarge and sid exclusively, and I have
seen no multibyte-related problems.
I also use a UTF-8 locale, and I can assure you that there are. Most are
surmountable, but will raise the complexity of an installation. (It's
not just "use LANG=de_DE.UTF-8 and everything will magically work" in an
upgrade scenario. Maybe not even in a new install--I don't know. Think
things like terminal emulator settings, fonts, remote sessions, etc.)
There are definately, e.g., issues with multibyte support in coreutils.
How much impact the issues have in the current context, I don't know.
Several weeks into the freeze might not be the right time to start
quantifying this.
Mike Stone
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