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Re: upstart: please update to latest upstream version

On Tue, Feb 21, 2012 at 09:03:51PM +0100, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
> On Feb 21, 2012, at 8:59 PM, Steve Langasek wrote:

> >> Debian has a history for providing a variety of packages with similar
> >> functionality and leave the choice up to the user.

> >> However, with systemd at the horizon, I don't see a need in supporting it
> >> either.  Ubuntu will probably make the switch in near future as well.

> > I don't know what gives you that impression.

> From my impression, systemd seems way more functional and well-designed
> than upstart.  It is - more or less - a clone of Apple's launchd with its
> socket-based activation and the capability to replace whole init bash
> scripts with internal code.

Yes, I don't know what gives you the impression that Ubuntu agrees with this
assessment and is likely to switch. :)

What do you know of the upstart design that makes you think systemd's design
is better?  The above could be a paraphrase of Lennart's blog, for all it
says about the upstart design.

The meme that systemd is better than upstart because it doesn't depend on
a shell is poppycock.  No one has done any benchmarking to support the claim
that /bin/sh is a bottleneck for upstart (particularly not on Debian or
Ubuntu, where /bin/sh is dash, not bash); OTOH, there are plenty of examples
of how the limited use of upstart's built-in support for shell scripts makes
for much more maintainable - and locally-modifiable - startup behavior than
if this were all implemented in C.

> There is a discussion about it here [1].

> [1] http://undacuvabrutha.wordpress.com/2011/04/29/why-ubuntu-should-continue-with-upstart-for-11-10/

Not sure why you think the comments on a blog post by a self-selected group
of users say anything about what Ubuntu is going to do.

Steve Langasek                   Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS
Debian Developer                   to set it on, and I can move the world.
Ubuntu Developer                                    http://www.debian.org/
slangasek@ubuntu.com                                     vorlon@debian.org

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