Re: buildd administration
Anthony Towns <aj@azure.humbug.org.au> writes:
> That's non-sensical. Everything the buildds do is logged pretty much
> immediately onto http://buildd.debian.org/, which also provides long
> running statistics on how effective the buildds are, and even a schedule
> of what the buildds will be working on next.
That tells us what the buildds are doing. It doesn't tell us anything
about what the buildd admins are doing.
> Well, the question is "are things wrong" ? AFAICS, they aren't -- and
> when I suggested building a webpage tracking the complaints, the only
> response was "ha, what a waste of time".
Can you explain then why my recent request went unanswered for a
month?
> Ingo's burnt a fair number of bridges wrt buildd issues; I'm sorry,
> but I don't really care if volunteers decline to work with people who're
> obnoxious and rude.
I do. For some positions in Debian, we need people who will work with
everyone in the project. When we have set things up so that there is
a single point of failure for a task, it is important to make sure
that one of the skills that single-point has is a very thick skin and
a willingness to work with people who are obnoxious and rude.
If we *cannot* find such a person, we might have to settle for second
best. But let's look for one first.
> That's not a productive attitude. If they don't have time to answer
> questions, they almost certainly don't have time to ask for help,
> either.
Hogwash. What seems to be absent from the mind of the people
responsible is that when they don't have time, they can say "I don't
have time to do this job anymore; I'm sorry, but I really would like
to step down."
We are a mature project, we can find volunteers for these tasks.
Nobody is doing a task in Debian which only they could do. Nothing
anyone does is so special and magic that nobody else could figure it
out.
What I think we have is *fiefdoms* in which people have tied their ego
together with "doing" certain tasks, and they are desperate to
continue to control those tasks, even if their ability to do them
efficiently has long since left the building.
I had hope that when we elected the current DPL and DPL team that some
of this would change. Instead, we have the same damn problem.
Fiefdoms, unaccountability, and DPL inaction.
> It may be rational to note that that conclusion is being irrationally
> drawn, and start responding to hysterical complaints by delaying
> activities that'd otherwise be undertaken, of course. I'm idealistic
> enough to dislike that conclusion, but, well *shrug*.
It is clear that some of the fiefdoms are run by people who adopt this
attitude: "If you criticize me publicly, then I will slow-pedal your
requests." This is an infantile and counterproductive attempt to
maintain control and a sense of superiority. It has no place in a
project such as ours.
Thomas
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