[Date Prev][Date Next] [Thread Prev][Thread Next] [Date Index] [Thread Index]

Re: new proposal: Translating Debian packages' descriptions

Hi Michael,

all in all, I think this sounds nice!

On Tue, Sep 04, 2001 at 01:22:16PM +0200, Michael Bramer wrote:
> 1.) use all the time _gettext_!

I agree, otherwise we'd just have to keep re-inventing the wheel.

> 2.) get the .po/.mo files on the system
>    If we don't like this process on the client all the time, we can
>    produce Descriptions-XX.po files and the clinet must only
>    download this file and save this in the right dir. But this file
>    will include the orignal description and with this it has the
>    double size and download time.

I don't know enough about gettext - am I assuming correctly that in
the .mo file, the English translation is replaced with a checksum or
similar, so you do not need to store the complete English translation?

> 4.) How get katie (or the desc-trans-XX.deb) the translation?

> 5.) translated descriptions in the package. 
>    I see only one problem: the size. 
>    We have now 80446 .deb packages and 7643 source packages in the
>    debian archiv on ftp-master. If we include the translation in the
>    deb, we must store this in the source and in every deb package. 
>    check this calculation:
>      If in all sources are only one desription with 130 (geziped)
>      bytes of description we get 1 MByte per languages. If we use po
>      files in the source (see below), we get 2 MBytes per languages
>      And all deb packages have only one description with 130 (geziped)
>      bytes. This make 10 MByte per languages. If we store the
>      description as po file, we will use 20 MByte per languges. 
>      11/22 MByte per languages, with only 10 languages we will get
>      110/220 MBytes. 

Hm, this sounds a lot, but note that relative to the complete archive
size, it's only an increase of about 1%. A well-invested way of using
this disc space, IMHO.

>    With more Packages, ports, languages, this will grow. This bytes
>    must all be downloaded, uploaded and synced with the time.
>    And on the local system the descriptions and the translations of
>    all languages from the package will stored on the local harddisk
>    (without gzip). Count:
>      With 10 languages, 1000 installed Packages and 380 Bytes per
>      description and per translation you get additional 4/8MBytes on
>      the local disk.
>    Is this all usefull in a 'normal' deb package from the debian
>    project? Maybe yes. We must decide this. (I personal don't find the
>    real pro about this. But we can add it and I don't have a real
>    problem with this. I see only the size problem, and this is not a
>    big problem.)

I think it's very important to have the translations in the *source*

For the binary package, I don't know... - Gnome and KDE do include all
translations, and I think it's easier to handle. Additionally, disc
space is really cheap these days, so maybe it would be better just to
include all the descriptions, too.

>    In all the cases I propose: store the description in the source as
>      .po file in the /debian/ dir (one per languages). This is the
>      only real good way to store the translations. (no encodeing
>      problem, no outdated text, no debconf-mergetemplate hack, ...)


>    But how get the maintainer the translation? We have some cases:
>     - The maintainer translate the description hisself
>     - He find some own translator (like now with debconf)
>     - He use the ddtp
>       - He can ask the ddts and get all translations of the package
>       - He can use the override file of katie
>       - He use the notification mails from the ddts (In future the
> 	server will use the decided format in this mail. With this,
> 	the maintaner must only copy this file in the source.)
>    Now the technique part:
>    The proposal with the biggest patch, is the 'put the translation in
>    a own element in the deb ar'. Maybe this is nice and feasible. 
>    But this is not a fast way. 
>    Because of this I propose some solutions:
>    1.) (very fast)
>      put the translation as normal .po file in the
>      /usr/share/desc-trans/<locale>/desc-trans.d/ dir. finish. 
>      This don't need some extra work on dpkg etc.

Actually, I think this is completely sufficient. Let the maintainer
include updated translations at his convenience in new uploads, and
use the override mechanism for the Descriptions-XX.mo.gz files until
he has done so.

Hm, but note that this means that dpkg will need to look first at
Descriptions-XX.mo files downloaded by apt, and only then at the .po
file in the package. Would that be a problem?

>    2.) Put the translation in the control.tar.gz of the deb.
>    3.) Add the desc-trans.tar.gz in the deb ar as a own new element.



  __   _
  |_) /|  Richard Atterer     |  CS student at the Technische  |  GnuPG key:
  | \/¯|  http://atterer.net  |  Universität München, Germany  |  0x888354F7
  ¯ ´` ¯

Reply to: