On Wed, Aug 12, 1998 at 08:35:51PM -0400, Dale Scheetz wrote: > On Thu, 13 Aug 1998, Michael Bramer wrote: > > On Wed, Aug 12, 1998 at 06:02:20PM -0400, Dale Scheetz wrote: > > > On Wed, 12 Aug 1998, Jules Bean wrote: > > > > On Wed, 12 Aug 1998, Michael Bramer wrote: > > > > > Today I have read the first time from the lcs projekt. > > > > > > > > IMHO, the 'validate' program should be modifiable, but should have a > > > > clause dictating that any modified version must be distributed under a > > > > different name, and clearly marked as such. > > > > > > And just what purpose would this "new" forked version serve? Validate a > > > different standard? Do some other job instead? > > > > A thought: > > We (debian) make a program to validate a debian system. (for cd-roms to > > put 'official Debian CDRom' on the cover) Now we must write a new program. > > You mean that the Debian program wishes to name itself validate, and my > program name conflicts with that? I will gladdly make the program name > LCS/LSB specific, like lsb-validate. But for that matter, Debian would be > better off naming theirs deb-validate, for the same reason. > > I don't see how the copyright on this code stops Debian from doing what > you suggest. With this copyright a Debian Maintainer can't make a copy from validate, rename it and make changes for his case! With this copyright this program must go to non-free! I have no problem with the name. Only your program ist 'validate'. My copy is grisu-validate, oder debian-validate. But with a free copyright a maintainer or a user can get it and use it in his owne idea. > > A sec. thought: > > I maintain X-Terms. On this Terms I check the files time to time. (with diff > > etc) With this program I can change my check program to a program like > > validate.. > > > What is to stop you from doing this? Look, this "program" uses several > while loops to check files whose names are provided from a list. There is > nothing in my copyright that keeps you from doing something similar. I > don't suddenly "own" the while loop structures that I have used, only the > complete text is copyrightable. Yes, I can make a new program with the loop and read files line by line. But why? Why can't I make a copy and change it? > > > I know that technically this is software, but I suggest that it is far > > > more like a pgp key. Do you see any advantage in being able to change the > > > contents of the developers keyring? Is there any reason why it should be > > > DFSG compliant? I see this validation suite as serving the same purpose. > > > It can't serve that purpose and be totally free in the DFSG terms. > > > > I can change the public pgp code! But this key is not usefull. Like the > > Program and the data-files from the lcs projekt. > > And I can change the keyring. I can remove keys and add keys and I have one > > usefull keyring. > > But you can't change some particular developer's pgp key on that ring and > have the same ring. In fact, if you publish the keyring with developers > keys removed you have also done a disservice to the purpose of the > keyring. If anyone but myself has the power to change my key on that > keyring (I mean the actual key value, as well as the key object) You Dale are a debian maintainer. You can get the pgp-keyring and you can remove my keyring and you can make an NMU to master. No copyright forbit this. Only your respect for debian forbit this. My and you goal is: make the best free distribution! Best _and_ free! > > If I like make a verify of a superset from the lcs files, I like to add new > > data entries to the data file and make a verify run... > > While you are free to do that in the privacy of your own machine. > (Technically you may be violating the copyright law, but I don't see quite > how anyone would enforce it) Oh no. please! What do you say? I can get a MS word copy and use it on my own machine? No the copyright don't allow this! Your copyright don't allow it too. With this copyright I can't change the program: - use the new program on my own machine - get the program to my friend - can't fix an 'rm -rf /' bug in the program and make a NMU upload - can't translate the Text-Output to france, german, ... - can't make a pached version and send it to you. I see only "can't" and "not allow"! This software is not free. Debian can't support it! But I can make a nice game with a progarm with the name 'validate' like: #!/bin/bash echo "This System is LCS conform" and make an dpkg-divert to the old script. If the game nice, alle debian user have it and all have a 'LCS conform system'! :-) No copyright can forbit this. You see: with this copyright you have no advantage! now date say: Thu Aug 13 03:50:07 CEST 1998 I go to bed. :-) Grisu -- Michael Bramer - a Debian Certified Linux Developer http://www.debian.org PGP: finger grisu@master.debian.org -- Linux Sysadmin -- Use Debian Linux "Now let me explain why this makes intuitive sense." --- Prof. Larry Wasserman
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