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Re: MaintainerDatabase Copyright

>>"joost" == joost witteveen <joost@rulcmc.leidenuniv.nl> writes:

>>  Two people, out of the blue? How about, the collators of this
>> data, in consultation with the policy manager and the founder of
>> Debian?

joost> I'm going by your email here. All you mention was that you and
joost> another maintainer (not mentioning any names) descide to do
joost> so. I have not taken part in this discussion, so if you say to
joost> me that there were two people, then that's what I think
joost> happened.

	I quote myself here:

Manoj> I think we changed the copyright without discussion since the
Manoj> copyright is decided by the authors, and is generally not a
Manoj> matter of opinion. People pointed out some flaws in the
Manoj> original proposed copyright; the authors of this proposed
Manoj> collection agreed, and we did not think it was unreasonable.

	I think people pointing it out to the authors definitely
 refers to more than two people.

>> It was pointed out to us that the GPL may not be quite appropriate
>> for a dataset like this one, because the GPL explicitly allows for
>> modifications of the data. In this case, that part of the GPL made
>> people uneasy, and I caould see no reason to have the data set
>> being mutable.

joost> I think I've given quite a few reasonable arguments in my
joost> email, that you chose to not to quote.

	I do not quote things from personal email.

joost> Please, read these references, included in my first post:

	I'm willing to be convinced otherwise. You have not done so
 yet. I would also appreciate it if people who intially had
 objections to the GPL to voice their opinion on this issue.

joost> In the end, it was you who decided to have GPL copyright. With
joost> the agreement of me, and implied agreement the others who
joost> contributed to the thread.

	Yes. I decided. I was convinced I was wrong, so I decided
 against it. Convince me, either by yourself or by an majority opinion
 (things are going your way, I have it now four people for the current
 licence, three against). I'd prefer the voice of reason, rather than
 one of passion here.

>> I wish that people had sought to help me modify the licence rather
>> than getting confrontational.

joost> I find it hard not to be confontrational again:

	You want a war, you'll get a war. Gird your loins. 

joost> I wish I could have contributed to working on the licence! The
joost> only reason I didn't, was because I didn't even know the
joost> licence was changing. Whoever changed it, it was completely
joost> without my knowledge, and, as you admitted in private email to
joost> me, without discussion on the debian mailinglist. How could I
joost> have contributed to forming the licence, if I didn't know
joost> anybody was unhappy with GPL?

	As an author, I rarely look to others to decide what copyright
 and licencing terms I'll choose. Since this is about voluntarily
 contributed data that is veing collated, I'll listen to the wishes of
 the people who gave the data in the first place. 

>> The people who caused the initial licence change came to me in a
>> non-confrontational manner, and convinced me of the

joost> I do not actualy think my email was confrontational. I just
joost> viewed the fackts as I saw them. I didn't know the group was
joost> any bigger than two maintainers (You and the other one). Yes
joost> you mention Ian Murdoc, but that's not a maintainer.

	Calling my arguments crap, and accusing me of being a part of
 a secret cabal hell bent on deceiving the debian community would
 generally be thought of as being confrontational. Not to mention that
 you conceded that, saying that you were ``mad''.

>> inappropriateness of the GPL.

joost> In my email I've spelled out clearly why I want to be able to
joost> modify the data, at least for personal use. Please, answer why
joost> you think I should be unable to make a list of maintainers that
joost> live in the Netherlands, or a list of maintianers + touristic
joost> hotspots.

	I think it is not unreasonable to modify the licence to allow
 "fair personal use" of the data. Any suggestions as to the wording?


 "Keeping proprietary and confidential information secret is the key
 to moving the computer industry into the 21st century." Letter from
 Apple Computer and Rasterops to the Macintosh user community
Manoj Srivastava               <url:mailto:srivasta@acm.org>
Mobile, Alabama USA            <url:http://www.datasync.com/%7Esrivasta/>

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