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Re: Bug#707851: Soften the the wording recommending menu files: let's do it in Jessie.

Hi Steve, Jonathan, and Josselin,

thanks to the two first of you for your comments.  Josselin, there is a
question for you below.

About the lack of guidance, I think that it is a weakness of my wording, where
for instance I used "applications" in one case and "programs" in the other
case, but did not underline what difference is meant.  For the media types,
section 9.7.2 basically says that mailcap should be used if desktop entries
are not used, but indeed this information could come earlier.  I am proposing
corrections below.

Le Sun, Jan 05, 2014 at 02:33:20PM -0800, Steve Langasek a écrit :
> On Sun, Jan 05, 2014 at 02:53:12PM +0900, Charles Plessy wrote:
> > 9.6. Menus
> > ----------
> >      Two menu systems are used in Debian: the _FreeDesktop menu_ and the
> >  1   _Debian menu system_.  Packages shipping applications that belong to
> >      one or both menu systems should provide the necessary entry files to
> >      integrate with them.
> It doesn't tell maintainers how to
> determine which menu system their package belongs to, and it doesn't tell
> maintainers of packages that want to consume a menu which one they should
> use.

How about:

    Two independant menu systems are used in Debian.  The FreeDesktop menu
    covers graphical applications that comply with minimal requirements of
    integration described below.  The Debian menu system covers all graphical
    applications and interactive text-based programs.  Packages shipping
    applications that belong to one or both menu systems should provide the
    necessary entry files to integrate with them.

I think that now this clearly shows that everything that is covered by the
FreeDesktop menu system is also covered by the Debian menu system.

> Furthermore, I think the idea of an application "belonging" to one system or
> the other is misplaced.

I welcome suggestions if "belonging" can be better replaced by something like
"relevant to", "in the scope of", etc.

> >         * In doubt, the package maintainer should coordinate with the
> >           maintainers of menu implementations through the _debian-desktop_
> >           mailing list in order to avoid problems with categories or bad
> >           interactions with other icons.  Especially for packages which are
> >           part of installation tasks, the contents of the
> >           `NotShowIn'/`OnlyShowIn' keys should be validated by the
> >           maintainers of the relevant environments.
> As a first cut this seems ok, but I would prefer to see more concrete
> guidance recorded in policy about what values of NotShowIn/OnlyShowIn should
> be used and when.

Josselin, it would be tremendous to have your input here since you wrote that
paragraph.  Others are of course welcome to make suggestions.

> > 9.7. Multimedia handlers
> > ------------------------
> >      Media types (formerly known as MIME types, Multipurpose Internet Mail
> >  3   Extensions, RFCs 2045-2049) is a mechanism for encoding files and data
> >      streams and providing meta-information about them, in particular their
> >      type and format (e.g.  `image/png', `text/html', `audio/ogg').
> >  #   Registration of media type handlers allows programs like mail user
> >  #   agents and web browsers to invoke these handlers to view, edit or
> >  #   display media types they don't support directly.
> >      Packages which provide programs to view/show/play, compose, edit or
> >      print media types should register them using either the _FreeDesktop_
> >      system or the _mailcap_ system.
> Again, I do not believe an either/or recommendation is appropriate here.

How about, in replacement of the previous paragraph:

    There are two overlaping systems to associate media types to programs which
    can handle them.  The mailcap system is found on a large number of Unix
    systems.  The FreeDesktop system is aimed at Desktop environments.
    In Debian, FreeDesktop entries are automatically translated in mailcap
    entries, therefore packages should only use one system at a time.

I expect that maintainers of packages with a FreeDesktop menu entry will
spontaneously declare media types through it and that it is not necessary to
explicitely tell them which one to chose.  I welcome suggestions of wording
if you think it can be improved.

Le Sun, Jan 05, 2014 at 02:39:41PM -0800, Jonathan Nieder a écrit :
> Do we have clear advice about
>  (1) how to write a menu entry for my console app (or niche graphical
>      app) without cluttering the menus used by the standard desktops
>  (2) when, roughly, it is appropriate to use that facility to hide my
>      menu entries

Hi Jonathan,

I think that it is not recommended to declare FreeDesktop menu entries for
non-graphical programs and that it is more obvious now with the clarifications
that I proposed.   For hiding entries, let's iron it out (see above), but the
final way to determine when it is appropriate is to contact the debian-desktop
mailing list.

Have a nice day,

Charles Plessy
Tsurumi, Kanagawa, Japan

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