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Re: TR: tasksel + gdm and accessibility issues for the d-i

Hi their. This probably should be in another thread, but while we're on
the subject of tasksel and I guess installations in general, is it at all
possible to make the GUI-based installer accessible with Orca?  I realize
that the Ubuntu-based distributions use Ubiquity with Orca, since its a
GTK 2 application.  My concern is that it is being more difficult to find
hardware synths available, and while installing via Speakup is certainly a
wonderful option, those who us who have a hardware synth that either is
not supported, or those who just dont' have access to one are totally
screwed. Its been a long time since I've installed Debian, as all my
machines here are running Sid. Just something I think that should be
brought up.


On Fri, 20 Feb 2009, Mario Lang wrote:

> Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 16:06:22 +0100
> From: Mario Lang <mlang@debian.org>
> To: Osvaldo La Rosa aka Aldo <info@brlspeak.net>
> Cc: debian-accessibility@lists.debian.org
> Subject: Re: TR: tasksel + gdm and accessibility issues for the d-i
> Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 15:04:02 +0000 (UTC)
> Resent-From: debian-accessibility@lists.debian.org
> Osvaldo La Rosa aka Aldo <info@brlspeak.net> writes:
> > Hi all,
> >
> > Even if I do really appreciate all the efforts done for making the d-i
> > one of the best in the world, I'm still frustrated to see some things that
> > could/should be much better implemented in future releases:
> Frustrated?  I am sorry to hear this.
> > 1) one of it resides in tasksel:
> >    this moment in the installer process is underexploited in our VI
> >    issues:
> >    I see a [*]Desktop or [*]Standard item marked for installation;
> >    but I miss a [ ]Desktop Accessibility entry. (Note the blank in the [ ]
> >    because of course sighted people doesn't need to activate it...)
> We've had discussions about meta packages and/or tasksel integration
> in the past.  While I agree with you that some kind of easy package
> installation wrapper would be good to have, there are a few design problems
> with the simple approach you are suggesting:
> * Your sentences above already make it clear, you are refering to
>   assistive technologies for visually impaired people.  However, accessibility
>   is actually a much broader term.
>    Just to name an example, one view of a person with special needs might
>    be that "dasher" is the package they need to properly interact with
>    their computer.  Another group of people might need gok, yet another
>    might just need gnome-mag but without Orca, and so on.
>    I feel a simple "Accessible Desktop" item in tasksel is not
>    enough to solve the problem generically.
> * While it is a possible approach to have the installer explicitly
>   select packages for the users who are going to use the machine,
>   it is also obvious that an administrator might not know in advance
>   that a person with special needs is going to use this machine.
>   If we think this through, we realize that what would be most desireable
>   is to have accessibility infrastructure installed by default on a
>   default desktop, so that a person with special needs can just activate
>   it at login time if they need to.  I feel that this approach would be even
>   better than creating a large number of meta-packages for various
>   disability needs.
> > 2) why not using this on a more coherent/logical way:
> >    IMHO if there would be an entry in tasksel as described above, that
> >    should be used to increase accessibility if the user marks it for
> >    installation, especially with consequences like these one:
> >    a) at the login moment in gdm: by providing a signal or voice or any
> >       sound/message (cf. my previous mail about this issue)
> Have you seen my reply to your mail regarding this issue?
> >    b) when marked for installation, that would have the consequence to
> >       run Orca by default from that point (gdm -> the beginning of the Gnome
> >       session). So if you're sighted and haven't marked the
> >      [*Desktop Accessibility item, then no problem, no login signal, no
> >      Orca.
> If a Linux machine were single-user by default, that would work.
> However, the orca startup setting is per-user, not per-system.
> > Isn't this a plan?
> >
> > IMHO this is a logical implementation to help with finishing the job: the d-i
> > is the only one who doesn't interfer with the needs of sighted persons,
> > while providing a good solution for VI people,
> > but having braille support at startup of the CD/DVD while
> > not having the possibility to enable gnome-orca from within tasksel,
> > sound a little bit absurd for me.
> Well, at least I, never use tasksel when installing a system.  I select
> the most basic configuration and then selectively install
> the packages I need.  Absurd, I think, is a little too strong a language,
> while I realize you are trying to push your cause.
> --
> CYa,
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