iMac DV with Rage 128 freeze
Maybe someone can add insight. Maybe Michael Daenzer?
This is my experience with debian-ppc and ubuntu-ppc on a slot loading
400mhz iMac from 1999 with an ati Rage 128.
I started to use debian about two years ago.
Early on, the recommendation were to install daenzer's xserver because
the default xserver was supposedly broken. And so I did this with woody
installs. Everything worked as far as I tested it.
On recent sarge installs, someone on irc told me that the default debian
worked fine. So I installed this thinking it might prove to be more up
to date than daenzer's xserver but this would result in unpredictable
lockups. Installing daenzer's xserver avoided this.
Latter on with ubuntu-ppc installs, enabling dri would cause the same
lockups as the standard xserver on debian-ppc. I noticed that most of
these freezes were with xscreensaver. The worst offending screensavers
seemed to be the opengl ones (I could easily repeat the freezes by
enabling them). So thinking that xscreensaver was responsible, I
removed xscreensaver-gl, rss-glx, and xscreensaver. The system seemed
more stable but there still was the occasional lockup (much like lockups
with debian-ppc and default xserver).
By this time I was fed up with ubuntu-ppc and reinstalled good old
reliable debian-ppc, reliable that is (for me) with daenzer's xserver.
Up to this point, I had thought the issues the same machine had with
debian and ubuntu were not related. This changed when I installed
xscreensaver onto sarge (sarge with daenzer xserver). I had never used
xscreensaer with debian-ppc (woody or sarge), but when I installed
xscreensaver onto debian-ppc I noticed lockups occurring during
screensaver operation much like the freezes with ubuntu-ppc. I removed
xscreensaver from sarge to find relief.
To see if I had figured out the offending packages (xscreensaver and
default xfree), I reinstalled ubuntu-ppc and removed their xserver, and
installed daenzer's xserver. I also removed xscreensaver-gl, rss-glx,
and xscreensaver. Voila, no freezes at all. Just little slow. The
slowness was mostly taken care of when updating to daenzer's dri, sid
version.
I had reasoned that the debian-ppc workarounds would also work for
ubuntu-ppc. I was right.
Thus there are two types of lockups with my hardware.
Type 1
Both ubuntu (warty and hoary) and debian default xservers freeze my iMac
at anytime.
Type 2
Both ubuntu-ppc and debian-ppc suffer from freezes associated with
screensaver operation (when xscreensaver is installed).
Now I imagine that I just stumbled onto this workaround because I can't
find documentation with systematic lockups on my machine (yes I've
looked through years of debian-ppc mailing lists). As I've read
elsewhere, nearly half of debian users probably do not set up X because
they use it as a server. Thus, problems with X lockups on a subset of a
subset architecture on an old outdated iMac (ppc/apple/old iMac) is
likely to not draw much attention.
Now I've been tempted to reinstall debian because I prefer it, but I
don't have the time or energy right now (I've done enough of distro
hoping). Besides, I figure my input into their bugzilla will draw a fix
that will be submitted to debian-ppc. The problem is that, despite them
looking into it, they have been repeatedly been unsuccessful in fixing
this problem. I first thought that maybe daenzer's xserver specifically
had a fix for this problem. As far as I can tell, daenzer's xserver
provides support for newer video cards than the main debian xserver.
What I've read from (ubuntu) devs:
1. I've heard some speculation that the problem is DRI related. That
the problem is not xscreensaver but DRI it uses to implement it.
2. I've also been told that the problem is with the monitor not allowing
the "easy access" of sync rates. This seems odd being that monitors
that had this problem are pre-1996.
3. I've also been told that the problem has nothing to do with the ati
Rage 128 card as it works on other architecture without freezes
(although they did not say they had DRI enabled). But there is a thread
of iMac users with simmilar iMacs all using related ati Rage 128 cards
reporting enabling dri causes lockups.
4. Devs have expressed doubt as to daenzer's xserver having any fixes or
the like because fixes would have been resubmitted into debian main, and
from debian-ppc to ubuntu-ppc (I guess I'm imagining my system not
locking up while I write this). Thus ubuntu-ppc should have the fix, or
be able to circumvent the lockups idiosyncratically if there never was a
actual patch. Doesn't daenzer's dri get submitted to regular debian?
Wow! It too a little writing to get this down. Does anyone know what's
up with these problems? And why my work around works? Is there a
precedence for these problems? on this arch? If so, I can't seem to
find evidence. I'd like to know or let developer's know because I can't
see myself using daenzer's dri forever. No offence Michael, but I've
read you write that you barely find the time to keep your sid repository
updated. And, if I recall, there seems to be some doubt as the what will
happen with "daenzer xorg". I do appreciate all your work, else I would
not run debian-ppc or ubuntu-ppc for that matter. I just think what
ever the problem is, it should be attended to by now in the main stream,
especially for such an old computer.
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