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Re: EOL date of lenny

On 11/01/12 20:22, Christoph Berg wrote:
> Hi,
> this looks like a rant, but is actually a suggestion on where people
> might look to find information.
> I just tried to find out when lenny is going out of support,
> i.e. when
> is "squeeze release + 1 year"?

It sounds like the sort of search term employed by someone that already
knows the answer to the question.

(I suspect a search of the release teams lists would find matches on
that term)

Maybe it just me - but I'd be searching for information on "lenny
security support"

> * Go to www.debian.org
>   The top section is just a random collection of (too many?) links,
>   let's skip it.

Those links don't seem random - they seem like some of the most common
things people would be looking for.

Lets see - Support (list heading).
That's where I'd start looking for a "Support" query. (except I'm lazy
and would have just typed "lenny end of support" into the search box).

No - nothing on that page about Support lifetime - at which point I'd be
thinking of way to improve my search term.

"*security* support lifetime" doesn't yield anything on lenny in the
first page of results, so I try "lenny security support lifetime"
Nothing in the first page of results there either (no complaints
Raphael, I'm not requesting "search suggestions").

>From there I'd either follow the links on the page I'm on (Support) to
the wiki, or the mailing list - and search for "Lenny security support
lifetime".  The wiki doesn't give me the answer, but the mailing list
does - in spades (seems a few don't search the mailing list, they often
repeat the same question in posts).

Admittedly I'd probably have started with a search engine before going
to Debian.org
The search engine I tried gave me the answer in the summary of the first
few results using any of these"
"lenny end of support", "lenny end of security support", "lenny end of

"lenny end of support site:debian.org" got me the answer as well (2nd

>   "Getting started" is not what I want, let's skip it.
>   "News" only goes back to July 2011, as squeeze was released around
>   February, let's skip this section.

Whereas I wound up following "Updated Debian GNU/Linux 5.0: 5.0.9
released" (because that's Lenny)- and it contained various security
items. But *not* the information you were looking for.
That's another place it might be useful to have a link to a page about
security support periods.

>   At the end of the Security Advisories, there's a link to the
>   security pages, go there
> * http://www.debian.org/security/

And before that there's a list heading called "Security" - where I'd
gravitate to the FAQ - scroll down to #24 and have my answer.

Debian.org => Support => rethink
Debian.org => Security => FAQ => "Q: How long will security updates be

OK - it explains the rule, and the reasoning. But I'd need to know the
release dates to get the answer. (if I was searching).

>   Security Information doesn't say anything about EOL, let's try one
>   of the buttons at the top

> * http://www.debian.org/distrib/
>   "Getting Debian" doesn't say when squeeze was released, let's try
>   the next button at the top

But if you were looking to see when Lenny security support ends - why
look for Squeeze release like that? Again - it seems like you know the
answer "squeeze +1 year".
In which case why not:-

Debian.org => Release Info => "released as version 6.0.0 on February
6th, 2011"

> * http://www.debian.org/support
>   "Support" links to the release pages.
> * http://www.debian.org/releases/stable/
>   There it is: Debian 6.0.0 was initially released on February 6th,
>   2011.
> Admittedly, there is a link on the front page to exactly this page,
> but it is in <small> font and hidden between lengthy other sections,
> so I didn't see it.
> As "Debian stable" is the only product we are selling (and maybe
> oldstable), I think there should be more "real" information about it
> on the front page, i.e. not only generic stuff people know anyway, but
> also information that changes with every release and people will
> actually need to look up. (The number of packages is a good example
> for that.)
> Christoph
> PS: Thanks for the new layout :)

I'd agree that the information is important, and not easy to find on the
Debian site (it's on wikipedia, for what it's worth).

Perhaps an entry at the top of the Support page (Security Support
Periods) leading to another page with the information on specific
support lifetimes, the rule that determines the period, alternative
support mechanisms (if any).

I'll echo the compliments on the new layout - and the latest tweak
improved the small scale rendering. Kudos - designing a simple, clean,
uncluttered interface to the universe of Debian information is no mean
Every year the amount of information grows, and the site layout and page
design improves. Thank you.


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