Re: Can you all please stop?
Russ Allbery said:
>Andrew McGlashan <andrew.mcglashan@affinityvision.com.au> writes:
>
>> If upstream is the problem, then they need lobbying; just accepting what
>> upstream does is a very serious problem
>
>I think this is an interesting statement. Personally, I would turn it on
>its head.
>
>I believe that the core, beautiful, exciting thing that we do inside
>Debian, and that any other excellent Linux distribution does, is exactly
>accepting what upstream does. Not accepting in the sense of passive
>apathy, but in the sense of wholehearted embrace of upstream's ideas,
>expertise, passion, and hard work, and finding a way to incorporate that
>into our distribution.
Not every upstream "contribution" is suitable for incorporation into
_our_ distribution.
>Acceptance in the sense of reaching out with both hands and taking hold
>of the gift we are given with a firm grasp and a grateful heart.
Nonsense.
What's happening here is Debian allowing _one_ upstream source to turn
_our_ distribution on it's head.
>Linux distributions are *all about* upstreams. Those upstreams are
>the reason why we're here.
Distributions choose appropriate components from upstream sources.
Components which are incompatible with a distribution's design are
clearly inappropriate.
>Those upstreams are the reason why Linux is something with a name that
>we can all use.
Distributions assemble disparate components from upstream and local
sources into usable systems.
>Those upstreams are individual people with a passion for some specific
>problem, who have dug into that problem and thought hard about it and
>produced the best solution to that problem that they can think of and
>implement.
Upstreams implement the solutions that they want to implement in the
manner that they see fit.
Some upstreams have an agenda, some don't.
>They are our friends, our colleagues, our benefactors.
[snip: metaphor]
>Accepting what upstream does is not a bug.
Doing so most certainly _can_ be a bug.
>Accepting, not thoughtlessly but thoughtfully and openly, respectfully
>and with passion and care,
The particular case at hand is an example of the tyranny of the
minority. It is clear to the un-blinkered that there's nothing
thoughtful, open, or respectful here.
>what upstream does is an act of gratitude, support, and friendship that
>helps weave our community together into something that's more than the
>sum of its parts.
The amount of user pushback generated by systemd is a clear indicator
that the whole will be less than the sum of its parts.
Ignoring the 800 pound gorilla in the room is nothing less than
hubris.
--
Steve Kostecke <steve@debian.org>
Reply to: