On Vi, 14 nov 14, 08:04:00, Marty wrote: > On 11/14/2014 05:26 AM, Andrei POPESCU wrote: > >On Vi, 14 nov 14, 08:59:11, Joel Rees wrote: > <snip> > > Jumping in here as myself, not Joel's tag-team member. :) > > >"Debian" as an entity doesn't really do much. There are only one or > >several volunteers who start doing things. Setting up a separate "port" > >for systemd would have been a major waste of resources (both human and > >hardware) with no real gain. > > By the same token systemd is a major waste with no real gain. It duplicates > equivalent modular alternatives, and also requires unnecessary effort to > repair damage from excessive coupling. I challenge you to come up with a configuration that duplicates systemd's features with a combination of other software. http://0pointer.de/blog/projects/why.html > >You are completely dismissing the work of Debian Developers who *did* > >have a very good look at the options and decided switching to systemd is > >doable and would be a good thing from a *technical* point of view. > > Non-responsive to his argument. If the work was biased and over-optimistic > then it doesn't matter how much they looked at it. This argument cuts both ways :) > >However, you and several others are rejecting systemd on ideological > >grounds. There's not much that can be done about that, short or > >re-implementing systemd according to your vision. > > Many others reject choice and the anti-choice stance is the ideological > position at issue here. It is in direct conflict with Debian policy. > The systemd upstream are the ones with "vision," ideology, rejecting > opponents as "haters" in an overt campaign to establish a Linux monopoly. > They have a financial interest in *psychological projection* of this kind. I > still cannot see what Debian stands to gain by jumping on their marketing > bandwagon. At least some of people rejecting systemd demand that it be removed completely, including libsystemd. How is it pro-choice to forbid me from being able to use a software at its full potential? > >I hope you do understand why neither the systemd developers, maintainers > >or users have any interest whatsoever in doing that. > > But upstreams have other interests, like establishment of a Linux monopoly > via tying and customer lock-in. Why should there not be a rational effort to > counter that? In my opinion the best "defence" against a monopoly[1] of any kind is to develop competitive alternatives. [1] which I don't believe applies, but will ignore for the moment. > After all, systemd > >already works fine for them. > > Windows already works fine for most people, and it is consistent with the > anti-choice philosophy, so why bother with Linux at all? Doesn't work fine for me. At $dayjob I'm forced to use it and I can tell you my private laptop with a Dual Core 1,8 GHz and 2 GB RAM runs circles around a Core i5 with Windows 7. But this is off-topic for d-u. Kind regards, Andrei -- http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser Offtopic discussions among Debian users and developers: http://lists.alioth.debian.org/mailman/listinfo/d-community-offtopic http://nuvreauspam.ro/gpg-transition.txt
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