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Re: implicit linkage (was: Re: Effectively criticizing decisions you disagree with in Debian)



On Du, 12 oct 14, 01:41:34, Reco wrote:
>  Hi.
> 
> On Sat, 11 Oct 2014 23:02:01 +0300
> Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> > On Sb, 11 oct 14, 23:20:34, Reco wrote:
> > > On Sat, 11 Oct 2014 20:47:36 +0300
> > > Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >  
> > > > At least with systemd if you fix a bug it will benefit all daemons using 
> > > > it.
> > > 
> > > No, quite the contrary. By fixing such jack-of-all-trades
> > > libsystemd library you're risking to *break* some other daemons.
> > > But, pretending your point is valid, fixing /etc/init.d/skeleton grants
> > > the same benefits.
> >  
> > Nope.
> 
> The reason being? Code quality of systemd is not top-grade (to say
> lightly), and the project hardly reached its' maturity. It'll only get
> worse from here.
> And, I have to ask. Are you denying both of my statements, or the last
> one only?
 
The last one only. I have no opinion on the code quality of systemd as I 
know nothing of C.
 
> > > > This is the same reason we are using shared libraries and the Debian 
> > > > Security Team is doing it's best to track code copies.
> > > 
> > > Consider /etc/init.d/skeleton a library then. It's sources to
> > > any /etc/init.d script anyway.
> > 
> > No, it doesn't. 
> 
> Again, simple 'no' is beautiful, but hardly contributes to the
> discussion.

$ grep skeleton /etc/init.d/*
/etc/init.d/dictd:# based on /etc/init.d/skeleton v1.7  05-May-1997  by miquels@cistron.nl
/etc/init.d/README:# Provides:          skeleton
/etc/init.d/skeleton:# Provides:          skeleton

It seems like you misunderstood the purpose of /etc/init.d/skeleton. 
It's not a library, but something to use as a base to write your own 
script.

As of Jessie most of 'skeleton' has been turned into 'init-d-script' 
though.

> > > > True, but sysv-rc still can't deal with them correctly.
> > > 
> > > It does not have to deal with the hardware, as it not its' job.
> > 
> > It has to mount filesystems.
> 
> No, it does not have to. In Debian, there's /etc/init.d/mountall.sh to
> do this job, in case initrd didn't care for it already. init(8) does
> not mount anything.

$ dpkg -S /etc/init.d/mountall.sh
initscripts: /etc/init.d/mountall.sh

I never said init(8) would mount anything, but sysv-rc. By sysv-rc I 
mean /etc/init.d/rc and all other scripts required to boot your system. 
Apparently most of these are split out in the initscripts package.

> And, to spice things up, [1]. Beautiful link telling everyone that it's
> not the init job to mount /usr as there's initrd for that.

But sysv-rc still has to take care your / and /usr is remounted 
according to your fstab and also for mounting everything else defined in 
/etc/fstab and how this interacts with the rest of the boot / daemons.
 
> Please enlighten me what exactly is systemd-specific here. Basically
> they tell "yadda-yadda-yadda, fix your applications, and if you don't -
> we have this 90-second hack for you".
 
Systemd makes it possible for me to adjust mpd's .service file to 
*require* a specific mount. This is not possible with sysv-rc's own 
mechanisms, I'd have to script it myself.
 
> Brilliant question. Certainly you've meant systemd, right? Just joking.
> Joke aside - because it's convenient to mount a filesystem once you
> really need it, and (which is much more important) - unmount it once
> it's not needed anymore.
 
You mean a systemd automount? Thanks for the hint ;) 

Kind regards,
Andrei
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