Re: Challenge to you: Voice your concerns regarding systemd upstream
Martin Steigerwald <Martin@lichtvoll.de> writes:
> Am Sonntag, 28. September 2014, 04:35:03 schrieb lee:
>> Martin Read <zen75502@zen.co.uk> writes:
>> > On 27/09/14 21:04, lee wrote:
>> >> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=990177
>> >
>> > Your complaint about the interface is reasonable. The systemd
>> > developers' decision to not change the interface in response to your
>> > complaint was also reasonable.
>>
>> I never said it was totally unreasonable. I'm saying it would probably
>> be easy to fix and that they simply don't want to. If they wanted to,
>> they could and would.
>
> It is still *one* bug report tough.
>
> Yes, I know there are others, systemd developers closed as won´t fix.
>
> Yet, look around a bit: That is true for *any* bigger software project I have
> seen so far. Lots of "won´t fix" bug in KDE´s bugzilla as well for example. And
> I do not always agree with the decisions.
Yes, making bug reports about KDE is futile. I haven't tried KDE in
quite a while, yet I'm sure they still haven't even fixed the scroll
bars.
> So acting for change, you may meet resistance. But that initially resistance
> is just that… an initial response towards change. A even natural response. Yet
> it does not mean that change is impossible. Quite the opposite is true.
I don't think it's natural that resistance against change comes up when
a bug is discovered and reported in some software. If that would happen
with software I wrote, I'd be interested in fixing the bug.
> I have seen systemd upstream and also systemd debian developers acting on bugs
> and fixing them.
Sure, sometimes bug are fixed. How often does that happen? At least
bugs reported about systemd get some attention.
> Yes, I was frustrated with some of the reactions of Michael Biebl for example,
> closing bugs quickly without resolving them, but first I found my tone at that
> time to be contributing to that outcome, and second after I pleaded to him in
> one bug report not to close it immediately, he didn´t close it
So nowadays you have to fall on your knees and pray to the great
developer to not ignore a bug, and you even take that for natural?
> … and… we worked together on some other issues. He told me what about
> he needs and I gave it to him.
Of course I'm willing to help with fixing a bug I reported as much as I
can. That is usually being ignored, with very few exceptions.
> It may also be true that systemd upstream won´t be willing to implement the
> change you want to see. But if you choose to keep your power with yourself,
> instead of giving it to others, you are still powerful, even in that case. An
> there are other options to create change.
Power not being used is usually taken and used by others.
> I also still believe that if systemd developers did completely off the limits
> think, they would quickly be forked. I also believe that if Linus messed up
> horribly with Linux developers, someone would start a Linux kernel fork. So I
> believe there is quite some peer review with systemd stuff and there is some
> real agreeing to they way it implements thing.
Then why aren't the concerns of those who disagree not taken into account?
> Its still about choice in Debian. Jessie will support alternative init
> systems. And you can help with that.
You believe in it, I don't. We will see what happens.
--
Knowledge is volatile and fluid. Software is power.
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