Re: shuttle disaster
On Sat, 2003-02-08 at 15:12, David P James wrote:
> Ron Johnson wrote:
> > On Sat, 2003-02-08 at 12:18, David P James wrote:
> >
> >>Travis Crump wrote:
> >>
>
> >>>
> >>>People and corporations produce their own money every day as well; have
> >>>you ever written a check? Try coming up with a difference between
> >>>checks, iou's, deeds, stock certificates, bonds, etc. and government
> >>>produced money that isn't circular, ie "the first set isn't money
> >>>because it is not government backed" Have you ever gone to a fair or
> >>>arcade where you have to buy 'tokens' to pay for the games/rides? What
> >>>are the tokens if they aren't money?
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>I'll give you a difference: liquidity. There are also differing degrees
> >>of transferability and risk associated with all the forms of assets that
> >>you've listed. I can't just use the tokens anywhere; they are probably
> >>only redeemable at that particular arcade, though I might be able to
> >>sell them to another arcade-goer at par or at a discount.
> >>
>
> >
> > David,
> >
> > You're missing the point, which is that "money", when it has no
> > intrinsic value (or backed by that which has intrinsic value, for
> > example, precious metals), become only, as another on the thread aptly
> > put it, "a means of keeping score", and is based on faith.
>
> Granted that money is a special form of asset because of its other roles
> as a unit of account and medium of exchange but in terms of having no
> intrinsic value it's not really alone as bonds, stock certificates,
> checks or arcade tokens don't have any intrinsic value either, and
> aren't generally backed by anything that has intrinsic value (except
> maybe the tokens, which are backed by a promise of a real "service").
> The "difference" is that all the above (except the tokens) are backed by
> a promise of money, which, as we have determined, has no intrinsic
> value, so, in that sense, they're all issued and acquired based on the
> same faith of the financial system's stability plus some faith in the
> stability of the debtor.
Au contrere (contraire?), bonds are *secured* debt (say, by that factory
that was built from the proceeds of the bond sale), and stock cer-
tificates confer partial ownership, and, thus, if the corporation
were to be liquidated, the holder of the stock certificate(s) would
get an appropriate % of the net assets.
--
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| Ron Johnson, Jr. Home: ron.l.johnson@cox.net |
| Jefferson, LA USA http://members.cox.net/ ron.l.johnson |
| |
| "For me and windows it became a matter of easy to start |
| with, and becoming increasingly difficult to be produc- |
| tive as time went on, and if something went wrong very |
| difficult to fix, compared to linux's large over head |
| setting up and learning the system with ease of use and |
| the increase in productivity becoming larger the longer I |
| use the system." |
| Rohan Nicholls , The Netherlands |
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