[Date Prev][Date Next] [Thread Prev][Thread Next] [Date Index] [Thread Index]

Re: debian-user-digest Digest V2003 #13



Please remove me from your email

debian-user-digest-request@lists.debian.org wrote:

> Subject:
>
> debian-user-digest Digest                               Volume 2003 : Issue 13
>
> Today's Topics:
>   Re: kde still sucks and gnome2 rocks  [ Paul Johnson <baloo@ursine.dyndns.o ]
>   Re: Nvidia compile error [SOLVED]     [ Elijah <desiderata@softhome.net> ]
>   Re: cannot open dislpay: debian:0.0   [ "Kevin" <linux@kd7hah.com> ]
>   Re: kde still sucks and gnome2 rocks  [ "Mark L. Kahnt" <kahnt@hosehead.dyn ]
>   Re: PCAnywhere and IPCHAINS           [ "nate" <debian-user@aphroland.org> ]
>   Re: mrtg and snmpd                    [ "nate" <debian-user@aphroland.org> ]
>   Re: cannot open dislpay: debian:0.0   [ Frank Gevaerts <frank@gevaerts.be> ]
>   Re: which files can be safely delete  [ "nate" <debian-user@aphroland.org> ]
>   Re: Nvidia compile error [SOLVED]     [ Elijah <desiderata@softhome.net> ]
>   Re: Getting nVidia to load            [ Bill Moseley <moseley@hank.org> ]
>
>   -----------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Subject: Re: kde still sucks and gnome2 rocks why?
> Date: Thu, 2 Jan 2003 07:11:39 -0800
> From: Paul Johnson <baloo@ursine.dyndns.org>
> To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
>
> On Thu, Jan 02, 2003 at 09:24:10AM -0500, Walter Tautz [MFCF] wrote:
> > I'd love to hear an analysis of why gnome2 rocks and kde does not. Perhaps
> > others would like to read about it :-)
>
> KDE gets in my way in all the same ways Windows does.  This is a Bad
> Thing.  This has nothing to do with what theme or wm I'm using in KDE,
> KDE just seems to be overly grandious about providing a freaking
> desktop environment.  The KDE menu is also organized very bizarrely
> (for someone coming from straight-out AfterStep).
>
> I've been using computers since I was 8, and I started on a VAX where
> my father was the sysadmin.  I, of all people, should not be
> overwhelmed by KDE.  Simplify it, folks!  KDE is so baroque, it
> wouldn't surprise me if it pisses off Windows users, and you've seen
> what kind of interfacial abuse they subject themselves to.
>
> There is very little I can't change in sawfish or gnome as far as
> sawfish or gnome are concerned in more than five mouse clicks.
>
> However, one thing that tweaks me about both DEs, still, is that they
> go out and clone xterm.  Uuh, why?  And why make it as ugly and only
> slightly more useful than Windows Telnet?  I realise that DE's are
> supposed to be most helpful for newbies, but *jeeze*, I have to wonder
> if anybody stopped for a moment and thought that maybe unleashing
> something as garish and stubborn as Windows Telnet on the Linux
> community isn't the right thing to do.
>
> --
>  .''`.     Baloo <baloo@ursine.dyndns.org>
> : :'  :    proud Debian admin and user
> `. `'`
>   `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than to fix a system
>
>   -----------------------------------------------------------------
>    Part 1.2.1.2Type: application/pgp-signature
>
>   -----------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Subject: Re: Nvidia compile error [SOLVED]
> Date: 02 Jan 2003 23:29:44 +0900
> From: Elijah <desiderata@softhome.net>
> To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
>
> Hi!
>
> It took me awhile to download new modutils, binutils, 2.4.20 kernel
> sources, etc. etc. .compile etc .. .. none worked for me.
>
> Then I searched all over forums, /usr/share/docs/, sites, etc. and found
> a suggestion to use the kernel-headers. I downloaded the
> kernel-headers.2.4.18.deb, untarred itself to /usr/src/, 'make install'
> the nvidia-kernels .. and it WORKED! ahhh that felt good ^.^ ...
>
> Compiling the kernel-source didn't help much so using the kernel-headers
> did it for me ... wow ... I've lost a ton of sleep on this one.
>
> Thanks very much to those who helped :)
> Elijah
>
>   -----------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Subject: Re: cannot open dislpay: debian:0.0
> Date: Thu, 2 Jan 2003 07:20:24 -0800
> From: "Kevin" <linux@kd7hah.com>
> To: "James Tappin" <james@tappin.me.uk>,
>      <debian-user@lists.debian.org>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "James Tappin" <james@tappin.me.uk>
> To: <debian-user@lists.debian.org>
> Sent: Thursday, January 02, 2003 2:27 AM
> Subject: Re: cannot open dislpay: debian:0.0
>
> > On Thu, 2 Jan 2003 02:12:34 -0800
> > "Kevin" <kevin@robertsesq.com> wrote:
> >
> > > FYI
> > > If I try xhost +localhost
> > > xhost:  unable to open display "debian:0.0"
> > >
> >
> > 3 alternatives spring to mind; either:
> > xhost +debian # as the original user
> > or:
> > export DISPLAY=localhost:0 # as root before running make xconfig
> > or even:
> > ssh -X root@localhost # instead of su
> >
> > --
> > James Tappin,             O__      "I forget the punishment for using
> > james@tappin.me.uk       --  \/`    Microsoft --- Something lingering
> > http://www.tappin.me.uk/            with data loss in it I fancy"
> >
> >
> > --
> > To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-request@lists.debian.org
> > with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact
> listmaster@lists.debian.org
> >
> Same on all 3
>
> unable to open display
>
>   -----------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Subject: Re: kde still sucks and gnome2 rocks why?
> Date: 02 Jan 2003 10:30:26 -0500
> From: "Mark L. Kahnt" <kahnt@hosehead.dyndns.org>
> To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
>
> On Thu, 2003-01-02 at 09:53, Walter Tautz [MFCF] wrote:
> > On Fri, 3 Jan 2003, CaT wrote:
> >
> > > On Thu, Jan 02, 2003 at 09:24:10AM -0500, Walter Tautz [MFCF] wrote:
> > > > > KDE still sucks.
> > > >
> > > > I'd love to hear an analysis of why gnome2 rocks and kde does not. Perhaps
> > > > others would like to read about it :-)
> > >
> > > Oh for the love of god! Should I put this thread in my twitfilter now?
> > >
> > > --
> > >         All people are equal,
> > >         But some are more equal then others.
> > >             - George W. Bush Jr, President of the United States
> > >               September 21, 2002 (Abridged version of security speech)
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-request@lists.debian.org
> > > with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster@lists.debian.org
> > >
> > >
> >
> > The intent was to get an analysis of the differences....alas this probably was
> > a bad idea since these kind of things usually don't end up being an analysis
> > but a contest who sucks least.... sigh
>
> My own observation is that each desktop environment and window manager
> is built with its own philosophy and design values, traded off with
> programming and design ability extended to the development. Peoples'
> preferences as to what they themselves use draws from their own
> priorities of what matters to them individually - be it speed, size,
> visual strengths or weaknesses, intuitive functionality, and choice of
> tools. Those that don't fit as much with one's own relative weighting of
> these values might be seen to be of increased "suckiness" ;)
>
> That means twm may be the cat's meow for some, while someone else wants
> Gnome on KDE with XPWE. Me, I run Gnome2 rather than KDE simply because
> I prefer the look and feel, and the ability to load up panels with
> applets - and since I run many gtk applications, many of the libraries
> that Gnome calls upon are already loaded. Some non-Gnome applications
> also call on gtk libraries, while I'm not familiar as yet of any non-KDE
> program calling on KDE libraries, outside of the QT toolkit (which isn't
> *really* KDE specific.) If I did use KDE applications, I'd probably be
> of a moderately different view, but currently, none of them are on my
> "favorites" list - that may change in the future.
>
> Does that mean it sucks? Nah - not to someone like me that still likes
> OpenWindows and FVWM in their own ways ;)
> --
> Mark L. Kahnt, FLMI/M, ALHC, HIA, AIAA, ACS, MHP
> ML Kahnt New Markets Consulting
> Tel: (613) 531-8684 / (613) 539-0935
> Email: kahnt@hosehead.dyndns.org
>
>   -----------------------------------------------------------------
>                        Name: signature.asc
>    signature.asc       Type: application/pgp-signature
>                 Description: This is a digitally signed message part
>
>   -----------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Subject: Re: PCAnywhere and IPCHAINS
> Date: Thu, 2 Jan 2003 07:40:06 -0800 (PST)
> From: "nate" <debian-user@aphroland.org>
> To: <debian-user@lists.debian.org>
>
> Simon Tneoh Chee-Boon said:
> >
> >    I've executed the following commands:
> > ipmasqadm portfw -a -P tcp -L externalip 5631 -R internalip 5631
> > ipmasqadm portfw -a -P udp -L externalip 5631 -R internalip 5631
> > ipmasqadm portfw -a -P tcp -L externalip 5632 -R internalip 5632
> > ipmasqadm portfw -a -P udp -L externalip 5632 -R internalip 5632
> > ipmasqadm autofw -A -r tcp 5631 5632 -h internalip
> > ipmasqadm autofw -A -r udp 5631 5632 -h internalip
>
> why are you doing both autofw and portfw? I would just use portfw.
>
> Also be sure when your connecting to externalip you do so from
> OUTSIDE the NAT network. my experience is that you cannot connect to
> the external interface of a port forwarded system from behind the
> same NAT that forwards it. Nor can you connect to the port forwarded
> system on the external ip from the NAT box itself.
>
> nate
>
>   -----------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Subject: Re: mrtg and snmpd
> Date: Thu, 2 Jan 2003 07:44:58 -0800 (PST)
> From: "nate" <debian-user@aphroland.org>
> To: <debian-user@lists.debian.org>
>
> James Vahn said:
> > <grumble> What misfortune has befallen these previously fine packages?
> > Snmpd has become so confusing and hogtied that it no longer performs any
> > function at all.. Does anyone know why?
>
> not really, but when was snmp NOT confusing and hogtied ? I've never known
> it not to be confusing.
>
> interesting command though, never heard of it myself, I usually just edit
> the .conf file directly.
>
> since you mention MRTG I'll mention my MRTG howto:
>
> http://howto.aphroland.de/HOWTO/MRTG
>
> nate
>
>   -----------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Subject: Re: cannot open dislpay: debian:0.0
> Date: Thu, 2 Jan 2003 16:49:53 +0100
> From: Frank Gevaerts <frank@gevaerts.be>
> To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
>
> On Thu, Jan 02, 2003 at 07:20:24AM -0800, Kevin wrote:
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "James Tappin" <james@tappin.me.uk>
> > To: <debian-user@lists.debian.org>
> > Sent: Thursday, January 02, 2003 2:27 AM
> > Subject: Re: cannot open dislpay: debian:0.0
> >
> >
> > > On Thu, 2 Jan 2003 02:12:34 -0800
> > > "Kevin" <kevin@robertsesq.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > FYI
> > > > If I try xhost +localhost
> > > > xhost:  unable to open display "debian:0.0"
> > > >
> > >
> > > 3 alternatives spring to mind; either:
> > > xhost +debian # as the original user
> > > or:
> > > export DISPLAY=localhost:0 # as root before running make xconfig
> > > or even:
> > > ssh -X root@localhost # instead of su
> > >
> > > --
> > > James Tappin,             O__      "I forget the punishment for using
> > > james@tappin.me.uk       --  \/`    Microsoft --- Something lingering
> > > http://www.tappin.me.uk/            with data loss in it I fancy"
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-request@lists.debian.org
> > > with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact
> > listmaster@lists.debian.org
> > >
> > Same on all 3
>
> try DISPLAY=:0
> (localhost==127.0.0.1==IP, while :0 uses unix sockets; and debian defaults
> to not listen on IP ports)
>
> Frank
> >
> > unable to open display
> >
> >
> > --
> > To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-request@lists.debian.org
> > with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster@lists.debian.org
>
>   -----------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Subject: Re: which files can be safely deleted?
> Date: Thu, 2 Jan 2003 07:54:53 -0800 (PST)
> From: "nate" <debian-user@aphroland.org>
> To: <debian-user@lists.debian.org>
>
> Sandip P Deshmukh said:
>
> > i was wondering if there are any other redundant log files etc that i can
> > delete to make more space available. i for instance know that exim keeps a
> > log and it can be safely deleted. any other files?
>
> if your that tight on space you may not need documentation, so I
> would say remove any *doc packages you have as well as manpages then
> erase /usr/share/man and /usr/share/doc that is 74MB worth of data on
> my system here. It would be better to remove this then to remove log files.
> You could also configure logrotate to rotate logs out of existance faster.
> Also /usr/share/info can go (remove any info related packages first)
>
> use dpkg -S /path/to/file to find packages that are associated with
> certain files.
>
> but the documentation is the best stuff to delete, most of it is
> available online anyways. a quick search reveals that debian manual
> pages are available here:
> http://www.math.u-szeged.hu/dwww/
>
> looks like general docs from /usr/share/doc are there as well. I don't
> know if this is a private site or public, or if it may go away in
> the future though.
>
> nate
>
>   -----------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Subject: Re: Nvidia compile error [SOLVED]
> Date: 03 Jan 2003 00:19:23 +0900
> From: Elijah <desiderata@softhome.net>
> To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
>
> Hi!
>
> It took me awhile to download new modutils, binutils, 2.4.20 kernel
> sources, etc. etc. .compile etc .. .. none worked for me.
>
> Then I searched all over forums, /usr/share/docs/, sites, etc. and found
> a suggestion to use the kernel-headers. I downloaded the
> kernel-headers.2.4.18.deb, untarred itself to /usr/src/, 'make install'
> the nvidia-kernels .. and it WORKED! ahhh that felt good ^.^ ...
>
> Compiling the kernel-source didn't help much so using the kernel-headers
> did it for me ... wow ... I've lost a ton of sleep on this one.
>
> Thanks very much to those who helped :)
> Elijah
>
>   -----------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Subject: Re: Getting nVidia to load
> Date: Thu, 2 Jan 2003 08:10:55 -0800 (PST)
> From: Bill Moseley <moseley@hank.org>
> To: Larry Hunsicker <lhunsicker@mchsi.com>
> CC: Debian user listserv <debian-user@lists.debian.org>
>
> On Thu, 2 Jan 2003, Larry Hunsicker wrote:
>
> > I am not sure why, in my setup, the nvidia kernel "make install" didn't
> > add the line to /etc/modules.  The nVidia folks may not have wanted to
> > force this at boot up.  But their documentation probably should note
> > that one needs to add this line to get the module loaded automatically.
>
> It doesn't need to be added, at least on my setup.
>
> $ /sbin/lsmod | fgrep nvidia
> nvidia               1467456  10 (autoclean)
>
> $ fgrep nvidia /etc/modules
>
> But I've installed the nvidia drivers twice now -- once via the debian
> source packages and once from using the tarballs from nvidia and following
> their instructions.  So maybe when I used the Debian sources it added the
> file to modutils to demand load.
>
>   $ cat /etc/modutils/nvidia-kernel-2.4.18-xfs-athlon
>   alias /dev/nvidia* nvidia
>   alias char-major-195 nvidia
>
> How module loading works is one of those unanswered questions I've posted
> to the debian-user list before.  I think I understand insmod, and that
> modprobe uses modules.dep to load dependencies, but I don't really
> understand modules.conf and how it works with modproble.
>
> I've read the "alias" part of the man page for modules.conf but still
> don't understand what those "alias" lines above do.
>
> My *guess* is that the X nvidia_drv.o module opens /dev/nvidia* and that
> causes a demand load of the nvidia driver.  But if that's the case I'm
> curious at what point the modules.conf file is parsed -- if that happens
> at boot or when /dev/nvidia* is accessed.
>
> Doesn't seem likely that it happens each time a device is accessed as that
> would be a lot of parsing of modules.conf.
>
> So if it happens at boot time then what loads that info into the kernel?
>
> Of course, I may have it all wrong.  It probably works by magic.
>
> --
> Bill Moseley moseley@hank.org



Reply to: