Re: Where is Debian going?
Drat the itchy send finger. The last message was sent too soon. Sorry.
On Wed, 10 Jul 2002, Derrick 'dman' Hudson wrote:
> On Wed, Jul 10, 2002 at 05:51:20PM -0400, Thatcher Ulrich wrote:
> | On Jul 11, 2002 at 02:04 +0800, csj wrote:
>
> | The Toy Story code names are cute but totally confusing; I say ditch 'em.
>
> Everyone has names -- even RH and Mandrake (Seawolf, Enigma, Cooker).
> There's nothing wrong with the names, really.
>
> -D
I like "poetry" in names. The Toy Story names are cute, even a bit poetic,
The names suffer from a bit of obscurity. Even t hough I am an old-timer
(I started with 0.93) I still have to think what the name, say, Buzz
(LightYear), means. I would NOT be willing to eliminate the Toy Story
names in favor of exclusive use of "unstable" "testing" and "stable".
Even if I do have some confusion occasionally.
Just a thought.
David Teague
> Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 18:49:40 -0500
> From: Derrick 'dman' Hudson <dman@dman.ddts.net>
> To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
> Cc: csj <csj@mindgate.net>
> Subject: Re: Where is Debian going?
>
> | > On Wed, 10 Jul 2002 11:03:17 -0500
> | > "Jamin W. Collins" <jcollins@asgardsrealm.net> wrote:
>
> | > Maybe instead of stable, testing, and unstable, we can have: server
> | > (must be stable), desktop (with newer but not bleeding edge stuff) and
> | > developer (because they're the ones who're in the best position to fix
> | > it).
>
> As long as the names' connotations convey their intent, it really
> doesn't matter what they are.
>
> Just be careful with calling one release "server" and one "desktop" :
> Do you want people to think that they can only run "server" on a server?
> (I run testing/unstable on some servers, and I say it is still
> better than RH)
> Do you want people to think they can't install debian on their
> desktop because "desktop" doesn't have official CDs?
>
> (that's what [wc]ould happen if you keep the same release model and
> just change the names)
>
> | MHO newbie opinion: emphasize version numbers (2.x, 3.x, 4.x) and
>
> That sounds fine for a "you can only get 'stable'" release method
> (like every commercial software house runs it), however what version
> is sid/unstable? What about testing? Only stable releases have a
> version number. If you tried to tack a version on testing and
> unstable, you would have to change it every time the dist changed,
> which would overflow my capacity for a version. Using a name is the
> simplest way to label a moving target.
>
> How hard is it really to learn that
> "unstable" means latest-and-greatest-but-who-knows-if-it-breaks-your-system
> "testing" means tested-a-bit-and-should-work-but-YMMV
> "stable" means tested-a-lot-and-is-really-stable
>
> Then you create a map that is correct until the next release, which
> right now looks like
> sid <-> unstable
> woody <-> testing
> potato <-> stable
>
> It is 6 names, but 3 of them are redundant. Half of the names are
> "timeless"; that is, they will refer to the same thing later as they
> do now. The other half are relative names; they refer to a certain
> stage in the release process, and those are moving targets.
>
> Since there are 6 different concepts at work here (5 really), 6
> different names are needed.
>
> | start using mnemonics that are less intimidating to the casual user,
> | or just de-emphasize the mnemonics altogether.
>
> I think the real "problem" there is that debian's development model is
> so different from every other software vendor that people find it
> "confusing" (IOW new and different). In fact, every other OSS project
> uses mnemonic names like "stable", "released", and "CVS" to refer to
> the different stages of their release cycle. Most projects aren't
> quite as large nor do they have as many stages, though.
>
> --
>
> The crucible for silver and the furnace for gold,
> but the Lord tests the heart.
> Proverbs 17:3
>
> http://dman.ddts.net/~dman/
>
>
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