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Re: Port Scan for UDP

thanks for your explanation.


On Sun, Oct 21, 2001 at 10:45:28AM -0500,
Craig McPherson <craig@bcm-hog.org> wrote:
> I can't believe nobody has answered this correctly yet.  UDP is 
> different than TCP in that it is a stateless protocol, and that means 
> you have to understand a few things to interpret UDP port scan results 
> correctly.  With TCP scans, you get one of three results:  OPEN 
> (meaning that the TCP handshake sequence to open a connection 
> completed), CLOSED (meaning that the target sent a "port closed" ICMP 
> message), or FILTERED (meaning that no response was received at all: 
> this is also called "stealthed" by so-called "security experts" like 
> Steve Gibson but it's a good idea to ignore him just on general 
> principles).
> UDP is a completely stateless protocol, though.  Even if you send a UDP 
> packet to a port that a valid daemon is listening on, the system isn't 
> obligated to send anything back to you at all: there is no handshake 
> sequence to establish a connection.  So making a determination is 
> harder than with TCP.  If you receive a "port closed" ICMP message, the 
> port can be safely listed as CLOSED, but if you receive nothing at all, 
> that could mean that the port is either OPEN or FILTERED -- it's pretty 
> much impossible to tell the difference.
> NMAP assumes that every UDP port that it doesn't receive a responsee 
> from is OPEN, which means that if you have your firewall DROP all UDP 
> connections, every UDP port will appear as open.  If you want to fix 
> this, have your firewall REJECT instead of DROP, and the ports will 
> appear correctly as CLOSED to a port scan.  DROPing connections without 
> a response is in violation of the RFCs, too, if you care about that 
> sort of thing.  Having the local machine portscan itself will also tell 
> you which UDP ports are *actually* open, because I assume you don't 
> have your firewall set to DROP packets from itself.
> Also, did you know that by default, nmap only scans ports listed in its 
> services file?  So although it scans commonly-used ports, it's not 
> scanning the entire system.  If you have enough time (this will make 
> the scan very slow, especially over a slow network link), use the "-p 1-
> " argument to every scan to force nmap to scan every port from 1 to 
> 65535 instead of just the maybe 400 or 500 ports that it has listed in 
> its services file.  That's the only way you can get a complete picture 
> of what your box looks like from the outside.
> > I'm doing portscans on a system I'm working to learn more about
> > securing hosts and setting up iptables.  My tcp portscan reported
> > what I expected, only www, ssh and smtp listening.  The udp
> > portscan reported a huge list of 'open' ports.  I really didn't
> > know what to expect for this scan, so I want to know if this is
> > normal.  Just for grins, I removed every udp listing in
> > /etc/services and restarted inetd and the scan came back the
> > same.  I figure this is normal, but if someone can confirm this
> > behaviour, I'd really appreciate it.
> > 
> > If this isn't secure behaviour, perhaps I can add an iptables
> > entry like:
> > 
> > iptables -A INPUT -p udp -j drop
> > 
> > However, I don't have any applications running using udp, so the
> > 'open' port doesn't have anywhere to go, as far as I know. 
> > Again, if someone can confirm this, I'd really appreciate it.
> > 
> > thanks,
> > jc
> -- 
> Craig McPherson
> Information Technology Coordinator
> Baptist Collegiate Ministry
> -- 
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 Volker Dormeyer * V.Dormeyer@t-online.de

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