Re: Debian sever ties with Google?
Thomas Goirand <zigo@debian.org> wrote on 31/01/2025 at 13:46:57+0100:
> On 1/31/25 03:59, Roberto C. Sánchez wrote:
>> Since we as a project have left Twitter/X (as recently announced by our
>> Publicity Team) on the basis of "We do not want to be present in a place
>> where we cannot ensure that users will be respected and where abuse
>> happens without consequences" [0] [1], I would like start a discussion
>> about how we as a project can promptly sever ties with Google.
>> Currently, the Debian project has a much closer relationship with
>> Google
>> than we have ever had with Twitter/X. Google is listed on the Debian
>> Partners Program page [2], which states:
>> "Google sponsors parts of Salsa's continuous integration
>> infrastructure
>> within Google Cloud Platform."
>> "Google is one of the largest technology companies in the world,
>> providing a wide range of Internet-related services and products as
>> online advertising technologies, search, cloud computing, software, and
>> hardware."
>> Additionally, Google is a DebConf25 sponsor [3].
>> Yet, Google has for a long time closely collaborated with the United
>> States Government, specifically with the Defense and Intellence arms.
>> This collaboration is no longer something that our project can continue
>> to turn a blind toward. Just within the last year Google has increased
>> this collaboration to the point of becoming a full-fledged and
>> enthusiastic participant in the US defense industrial complex.
>> 2024-04-09: "Google is now authorized to host classified data in the
>> cloud" [4]
>> "We're thrilled to announce another significant milestone for Google
>> Public Sector: the authorization of Google Distributed Cloud Hosted to
>> host Top Secret and Secret missions for the U.S. Intelligence Community,
>> and Top Secret missions for the Department of Defense," Leigh Palmer,
>> the company’s vice president of delivery and operations said at Google
>> Cloud Next conference in Las Vegas. "This authorization underscores
>> Google Public Sector's commitment to empowering government agencies with
>> secure, cutting-edge technology."
>> 2024-04-17: "Google Public Sector ‘hitting our stride’ in government
>> market, CEO says" [5]
>> "Being authorized on secret and top secret for the most stringent
>> government requirements more than anything demonstrates Google's
>> commitment to this market. I’m so proud of that. You know, I'm a mission
>> junkie, former Navy officer, this is what I came to Google for: to be
>> able to deliver on the promise of Google technology and those missions."
>> This goes far beyond the US Defense and Intellence agencies
>> purchasing
>> the same mass market products which are available to everyone, far
>> beyond benign public sector services for education and healthcare.
>> Google is specifically tailoring products and services, in close
>> collaboration with the US Defense and Intellence agencies, to
>> specifically increase the capabilities of those agencies.
>> Since there are people within the project who will not even travel
>> to
>> the US because of problematic policies and overreach by the government,
>> especially by intelligence agencies, it seems highly problematic for us
>> to continue accepting Google as a sponsor. Especially given the fact
>> that Google has become a de facto part of the US government, and
>> especially of its intellegence arm. I feel far more threatened by a
>> continuing relationship between Debian and Google--knowing that Debian
>> shares a computing platform and resources with the monsters responsible
>> for thousands of drone strikes across the world, being responsible for
>> countless civilian deaths, as well as who knows what other atrocities
>> both inside the US and across the world--than by our former use of
>> Twitter/X as a platform for publishing bits of news about the project.
>> And a continuing relationship between Debian and Google objectively
>> poses a far greater threat of far greater harm to far more people than
>> did our former use of Twitter/X.
>> I am calling for those responsible for the Debian Partners Program
>> to
>> immediately discontinue the partner relationship with Google and then
>> for those responsible for managing the various Google-integrated and
>> Google-hosted Debian services to being the process of divestiture.
>> Regards,
>> -Roberto
>
> Hi Roberto,
>
> I largely agree that we should reduce our use of sponsored hosting
> space in general, and Google (non-free) cloud platform specifically.
>
> To do this, Debian would need to run its own cloud platform as a
> replacement. I've been advocating for it, and volunteered to maintain
> an OpenStack cloud deployment for Debian own use.
>
> If you wish that Debian gets out of using Google, engage in this
> effort, and find somewhere we can host such a deployment (then Debian
> can spend the money for buying the hardware). At this time, I have no
> clue where we should go, and I have no time to research it, plus I do
> not wish to get my employer involved to avoid any type of conflict of
> interest.
The thing is, having a cloud platform, hosting it and maintaining costs
plenty money that we don't really have.
--
PEB
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